So a Touareg (for which a model similarly equipped to an Elite - comes in $10K more expensive - and their "base model, is more than a Touring), has jump-start connections - and the Pilot is a "bad design" because it does not?

There's only so much you can do, in a design, to make things "more convenient".

You had to remove the snorkle on the previous gen also, to get to the battery. Which I had to do 3X. Once to replace the factory battery with a "Yellow Top", once to replace the Yellow Top, and once to jump it, when I left the lights on and ran it down.

On the 16's, this "engine cover" is "pins" that pop right out, and the snorkel is 2 push pins.

The only "design flaw" I'm pissed about, is, what "used to be" a "tray" - where the snorkel came off on my '12 - is now a bottomless pit that eats push-pins, tools, flashlights (don't ask how long it took to fish my flashlight from behind he bumper cover, I almost pulled the bumper cover to get to it - and you can bet that will NEVER HAPPEN AGAIN).

As a previous ASE Mechanic (2 lifetimes ago) I still carry a Gold Card that's better than an American Express - my AAA Plus Motorcycle Card - which I've had since 1985. CHEEP INSURANCE - especially if your wife isn't into wrenching (I think #4 for me has got to be a bit of a grease monkey - or at least can ID tools when I call out for them).

Rick

 

Rick,

Just because the Touareg which is 10k more expensive for a similar equipped to the elite doesn't mean to much when the Touareg breaks down left and right. Hence why I got rid of it.

As bad design a jump start should be easy access and quick to do. Shouldn't have to take 5-10 minutes to disassemble things to access the jump points. Last thing you want to do with a family and kids in the car when it doesn't startup is fumble around to get to the jump points.

I agree with your statement to make things "more convenient", but lets be honest here most of the drivers of the pilot are not ASE Mechanics but more family drivers who barely even go under the hood in general.

By the way, the snorkel are not 2 push pins as they were in my 2012. They are 2 Philips screws.

And this post was more to make sure ppl with the Pilot understand how to jump as Honda isn't going to modify this. Most of the daily family drivers out there have no clue to do a normal jump start let alone now having to try to get access to the battery terminals.

 

There must have been a redesign since the owners manual was written. I went to look at the engine compartment. There is a cutout in the air filter box which allows access to the positive (red) terminal of the battery. There is a little swing away access plate on the terminal. For a negative connection, one of the mounting bolts for the brake reservoir works.

Now removing the battery that's a totally different challenge. If its like my other late model cars, DIY is challenging since certain computers need to be rebooted or reset, unless one had a memory saver.

 

I call it a bad design choice. I'm a retired aerospace engineer and IMHO it's a compromise for some other requirement. I am surprised that customer convenience is held in second place to something else. I can only conclude Honda considers the owner will trade in before the battery dies or have it towed.

As far as tow services and battery jump starts, I've never seen a tow truck operator do anything more than connect the jump cables. Me thinks that a dead battery will be an automatic tow to the nearest service station. I smirk at the thought that a tow truck driver will peruse the owners manual and figure it out.

The major flaw here is if Honda expects the driver to access the battery, they should have provided tools, ala the German car makers.

There are no "tools" required.

The front "splasher cover" (aka: engine cover) is all pins that come right out (watch the pins on the far corners, they come off the cover really easy and drop off into the never-never-land of the engine compartment - ask me why I have 4 spares in the glove box). Incidentally - this cover pretty much has to come off - in order to add oil (that and a really LONG/THIN funnel - have fun adding oil at your local Hess station), which I find inconvenient - but not so much so, that I would dedicate a post on a Pilot forum about it.

The snorkel is 2 push pins (again - ask why I have a full set of 4 replacements for EVERY PUSH PIN on the vehicle - every single one becomes useless after 2 or 3 removals) - you can pull these with a butter knife (yeah - we all ride around with butter knives, but y'all get the drift).

So, call me CALLOUS or JADED (since I do all my own mechanical work on ALL my vehicles - as much I DON'T TRUST ANYONE ELSE, as it is the love and pride of working on my own stuff), but I wouldn't expect my wife (no current one, but we can use my 3-EX-WIVES as an example) to even know or care how to get to the battery on their vehicle.

I find it interesting how, with the nicest and coolest vehicle in the Honda line-up, that people find the nit-pickiest things to complain about. Especially in the case of a battery that MOST will never have to get to, in the entire lifetime of their ownership (absent leaving lights or an accessory on and killing the battery).

I don't expect everyone here to be a Rocket Scientist, nor do I expect everyone to have been ASE Certified in a previous life - but really - if I can get to my battery in UNDER 60 SECONDS (including cursing at the damn pushpins), then I don't find it all that inconvenient.

Now - would it have been NICE for Honda to include "remote jump start terminals" - yeah, sure - I'll roll with y'all there. OTOH - they probably considered the "remoteness" of the possibility of using them more than once over the life of the vehicle, to outweigh the cost of doing so - and I'm pretty OK with that decision.

And I just went out and looked - ClermontFlash is correct - the + terminal is accessible without removing anything (also - my Touring IS pushpins - but it was also built on 6/8 - so it was once of the first off the line - I don't know about Philips screws - but if hey are the PLASTIC ONES - I'd almost PREFER the PITA pushpins). And you would typically want to use a chassis or motor part for the - jumper wire anyway - so jumpstarting this car is pretty darn easy.

OTOH - I'm the guy that had his dash out the day I got the car (to install my laser jammer and hardwire kit for Valentine 1), and the guy that has had his entire interior out to install speakers, amps and design/build a custom sub box - so, granted - I am not your "typical end user".

Rick

 

Installed factory trailer wiring harness on 16 ex-l. Directions said remove intake to disconnect neg. terminal, sure enough, the part the phillips screw goes into popped out , not to be found with all the covers underneath. I should've just done the pos. terminal. And as previous poster said, watch the rubber grommets on the engine cover, fortunately, mine made it all the way to the ground.

 

Rick,

Here is the pic of the 2 Philips screws for the snorkel as I took pics when doing my HID install.


I am not nit-picking but more educating and ensure ppl that have the Pilot understand that when in the situation if you need to jump the battery it isn't as easy as just plugging jumper cables on and jump you go. And as far as you stating you shouldn't need to jump the battery you are correct! But what if you wife decided to leave the car in the on position to let your kids watch the RES and drain down the battery. Family don't think of that sometimes and in a pinch you should be well prepared in regards to how you would fix it. A normal battery jump back in the 80's or 90's car isn't the same anymore.

And yes the Positive Terminal is accessible barely without moving anything. Negative is another story.

And again the UPDATED manual states to remove all that I said above.

And no you aren't the typical user by any standard. Wish I had the knowledge you do for these things.

 

Probably ran out of push pins. Are the the PLASTIC SCREWS?

Replace them with push-pins of they are - these are (likely) the same screws used in the front wheel wells, and they are rendered even more useless after they've been r&r'd more than once.

I'm a computer tech by (current) trade. I do my own wrenching out of passion for my toys, financial necessity (being a mod-aholic gets even more expensive when you have to pay for labor), and because I get to use some of the tools that are all over my garage.

My mod-aholism costs me more than my (ages-old) crack addiction - but I get to KEEP MY TOYS now - not smoke them up.

Think this horse has been thoroughly beaten - so - I'll bow out now...

Rick

Side note mtbiker53 - you DO NOT WANT TO DISCONNECT ONLY THE (+) TERMINAL - unless you want to see what ARC WELDING WITH A BATTERY CABLE LOOKS LIKE (ask me how I know - not on this car - but a lesson learned as a teenager). Take the EXTRA TIME to disconnect the NEGATIVE CABLE - and place it where it CANNOT MAKE CONTACT with the terminal on the battery. This "safes" all the expensive computers in the car. Nothing more embarrassing than flatbedding a "basket case" into a shop (again - ask me how I know - from both the shop AND OWNER side of the equation).

 

Yep, plastic screws.

 

It should definitely be easier than what is indicated in the manual to jump start a car. Even if it isn't a big deal to remove all of those parts to access the battery, I wouldn't want to have to put them back on when the engine was running. If you drop one of those screws (or push pins if an individual chooses to replace them) it will get sucked into the airbox and then you will have to shut off the car, open up the airbox, get the screw out, reassemble, jump start the car again, and then attempt to install the snorkel again. It is an incredibly stupid design that I would agree verges on a "design flaw".

Fortunately it sounds like Honda provided a second location for the positive terminal connection that can be used for jump starting.

 

that's just BS. There should be some posts or connection that doesn't require you to do anything but connect the jumper cable.

 

Add this thought for future reference, when buying a new or used vehicle. Do a thorough expectation and don't get caught up in all the bells/whistles.

I'm sure that a discerning eye and a look at the engine compartment, would have spotted this as a deal breaker for most.

That being said, engineers sometimes struggle with where they are going to place certain components.
Maybe they just want you to leave the bloody thing alone! Choices and consequences my friends.

I like to change my own battery here in Arizona. Heavens knows we go through them quickly enough here.

I personally don't see this production run in my future.:headshak:

 

That being said, engineers sometimes struggle with where they are going to place certain components.
Maybe they just want you to leave the bloody thing alone! Choices and consequences my friends.

As components get squeezed into tighter and smaller spaces, space conflicts and compromises are inevitable.

Batteries are always held down by two to four bolts and also require tools to remove the terminals. A couple of screws doesn't make much difference when replacing it.

Welcome back Spikeaudi. Long time no see.

 

There is an item called an "external or remote battery jumper box." You would have to find a place to mount it. -- It's easier to tape something like a P touch label, to the the air filter box with a note "remove screws and air filter box to access battery terminals."

 

Chevy figured this out back in the 90's

http://www.autozone.com/repairguide...-2000/JUMP-STARTING-A-DEAD-BATTERY/Jump-Starting-Procedure/_/P-0900c15280217a91

 

Side note mtbiker53 - you DO NOT WANT TO DISCONNECT ONLY THE (+) TERMINAL - unless you want to see what ARC WELDING WITH A BATTERY CABLE LOOKS LIKE (ask me how I know - not on this car - but a lesson learned as a teenager). Take the EXTRA TIME to disconnect the NEGATIVE CABLE - and place it where it CANNOT MAKE CONTACT with the terminal on the battery. This "safes" all the expensive computers in the car. Nothing more embarrassing than flatbedding a "basket case" into a shop (again - ask me how I know - from both the shop AND OWNER side of the equation).

Good point for everyone. As a mechanic for 40+ yrs tho, I've got it covered.

 

I am - actually - completely in shock to believe that someone would "pass" on a '16 Pilot - because of the (cough cough) "design flaw" of not including remote jumper terminals, and putting someone through the agony (ohhh, the pain) of having to pull the intake snorkel to get to the battery terminals.

All I can say is - WOW - just WOW...

Rick

 

The problem is that it's not a mustang or vette (or something that the average guy is gonna be into with a wrench on weekends), its a soccer mom mobile. Stuff really does need to be easy to get to regardless of whether you are being jumped or doing the jumping for another vehicle. I should be able to talk to my wife on the phone and say "connect that to this, and this to that" and call it good.

I wouldn't say it's a design flaw but rather a poorly thought out detail. It definately wouldn't keep me from buying the car.

Now the issue of still having a timing belt on a v6 in 2016, that really made me think about it. Still annoyed about that.

 

Personally, I have become a big fan of Priority Start units.

PriorityStart - Stop Dead Batteries on Cars & Boats [Priority Start! Battery Protector]

With the chore that getting to the battery looks like this would be an ideal application. Install once and never have to worry about jump starting again.

--Harry

 

Personally, I have become a big fan of Priority Start units.

PriorityStart - Stop Dead Batteries on Cars & Boats [Priority Start! Battery Protector]

With the chore that getting to the battery looks like this would be an ideal application. Install once and never have to worry about jump starting again.

--Harry

Except when the battery fails.

 

People might want to read about the Pilot Battery Management System before worrying about jump starting the vehicle. The following link has much interesting information about the Pilot. Scroll down to read about battery management.

2016 Honda Pilot - Powertrain - Honda News

 

People might want to read about the Pilot Battery Management System before worrying about jump starting the vehicle. The following link has much interesting information about the Pilot. Scroll down to read about battery management.



2016 Honda Pilot - Powertrain - Honda News

Nice!

 

The fact that this thread for jumping a battery is necessary is a disappointment. We saw this 2 minutes before we signed the paper work. I don't understand why Honda didn't include posts for us to jump our cars. Especially for the ones that shut off at red lights and such. Not like posts haven't been invented yet.

 

I saw the battery issue the moment I went to see the car. The first thing I did was open the hood in the showroom to see the engine components. I guess I'm in the small percentage of people who don't see it as a big deal. I have rarely ever needed to jump a car in the last 10 years. Once in a while I may accidentally leave a dome light on here and there but it's not enough to drain the battery. When the battery does need to be replaced chances are I'm going to take a separate car to go get the battery and spend the time putting it in and cleaning the battery contacts with baking soda/water mix - that might be one time during the life of the vehicle


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

 

We're talking about jumping the Pilot battery here right? Black clamp connects to an unpainted ground...

Now if you're using the Pilot to jump another car...

 

Absolutely right, as long as the red post is showing that's all that is needed.

Personally i always have this in my car, for me and if anyone else needs a jump.

PowerAll

 

I am confused... are you guys saying in order to jump start the car/battery, I need to unscrew some items before I can access the correct terminal/s? Can somebody summarize please?

 

i haven't confirmed but no.

in order to jumpstart the pilot, the Positive + (red) posts is available to connect. You would then attach the Negative - (black) to any bare ground bolt, which there are tons of.

To jumpstart another car, you will need to remove the parts of the airbox to get access to the negative terminal.

 

Ok... Here's the manual

 

This may have been lost in automotive lore, but in the olden days it was considered good practice to make the final connection to a good ground point remote from the battery of the vehicle being jumped, because there is the potential for hydrogen and oxygen gas venting during rapid charging of automotive lead-acid batteries. Especially if the battery was low on electrolyte and has plates exposed to atmosphere, and most especially if the battery was an old-school open-vent design, the spark produced from the final electrical contact completing the circuit could initiate sudden chemical recombination of said hydrogen gas and oxygen gas in an exciting manner. BOOM!
BTW, BS aside, this isn't really as funny as it sounds, because being sprayed with concentrated sulfuric acid and shrapnel of lead and plastic, well, that could spoil anybody's day.

 

I had it happen to me when I was about 19 helping a young lady at the mall get hers jump started. :surprise:

Having jumped hundreds of vehicles that is the only time it ever happened and the last time I hooked up the cables that way. :wink:

BigDozer66

 

^^^^ This happened to my Grandfather and his late 50's Chrysler ^^^^

 

Lock this thread please....the whole thread is pointless. You don't need to remove the airbox to jump start the car. Period. It is a non-issue that someone created a thread about based on incorrect/out of date information.

 

Yeah... this is a non-issue. The battery positive is in plain view. Flip the plastic cap to access the post.

 

That's interesting, but what does that have to do with a properly designed/maintained chain system? I have had many engines with timing chains and had no problems.

 

As the investment advisors like to say, past performance is not a guarantee of future returns.
Just because you've had many engines with timing chains and had no problems, what assurance do you have that the next vehicle you buy with a timing chain will have been properly designed?
No doubt the buyers of a Traverse, Acadia, Enclave or Outlook weren't expecting any timing chain troubles.