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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My pilot has 56,500 miles. Last visit to the dealer I was told break pads in front were 5mm and in back 4mm.
was recommended to replace and cut disks. What is the safe and appropriate gage to do the job? is there a repair or maintenance manual to use as a guideline?
 

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Brake fluid every 3 years, pads and or rotors when they need it. When I traded my 2013 Pilot Touring for a 2020 Passport Touring the Pilot had 71K on it and the original brakes. They were getting close to needing to being done, but I was just getting down to 4mm on the fronts. The rears were at 5mm.

Its usually best to change them when they get down to 3mm. If you go far enough for the pads to tell you then you run the risk of scoring the rotors.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thank you for your reply. Do you know if it is possible to find a maintenance manual or do it yourself manual? In essence documentation that will allow monitor and allow the proper performance of the car and in some cases a do it yourself (taking care). I have another post regarding the center console shutter. I will try to find the part, but if I can would like to do the replacement myself if feasible.
Regards
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Brake fluid every 3 years, pads and or rotors when they need it. When I traded my 2013 Pilot Touring for a 2020 Passport Touring the Pilot had 71K on it and the original brakes. They were getting close to needing to being done, but I was just getting down to 4mm on the fronts. The rears were at 5mm.

Its usually best to change them when they get down to 3mm. If you go far enough for the pads to tell you then you run the risk of scoring the rotors.
Brake fluid every 3 years, pads and or rotors when they need it. When I traded my 2013 Pilot Touring for a 2020 Passport Touring the Pilot had 71K on it and the original brakes. They were getting close to needing to being done, but I was just getting down to 4mm on the fronts. The rears were at 5mm.

Its usually best to change them when they get down to 3mm. If you go far enough for the pads to tell you then you run the risk of scoring the rotors.
How do you like the 2020 passport?
 

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In most cases, pads can be changed without any rotor work. Cutting rotors in general is dumb. If they are 'out' and need cutting, it means they will be thinner in areas that get the most stress. Not to mention, you can buy and install aftermarket rotors like Centric for a lot less than service will charge for cutting.

After replacing pads, be sure to bed them. Go to some deserted road and do a series of accelerations followed by rapid braking (hard from 50+ mph to like 10) like 15-20 times, but never coming to a full stop. Then drive around normally a bit so brakes can cool off before you return home.
 

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Thank you for your reply. Do you know if it is possible to find a maintenance manual or do it yourself manual? In essence documentation that will allow monitor and allow the proper performance of the car and in some cases a do it yourself (taking care). I have another post regarding the center console shutter. I will try to find the part, but if I can would like to do the replacement myself if feasible.
Regards
You could check the Chilton and Haynes site, It's probably going to be an online or subscription thing.


How do you like the 2020 passport?
Love it. We really liked the 2013 Pilot Touring, but with just the wife and I it had a lot of features we didn't need, use including the rear entertainment system and the 3rd seat.

The Passport fits our lifestyle much better. Seating for 5 is quite adequate for us and the large rear cargo area is very nice. It also, being a Touring model it has the more rugged suspension of the top end Ridgeline. I do a bit of off roading, nothing heavy duty and appreciate the extra height over the Pilot.
 

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My pilot has 56,500 miles. Last visit to the dealer I was told break pads in front were 5mm and in back 4mm.
was recommended to replace and cut disks. What is the safe and appropriate gage to do the job? is there a repair or maintenance manual to use as a guideline?
Watch any of the brake pad/disc replacement videos on the South Main Auto youtube channel.
There should be some for a Honda.
Be sure to check (and relube, if necessary) the caliper slide pins.
 

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Cutting rotors is becoming an obsolete practice. It leaves you with less metal to dissipate heat, which can quickly lead to pedal pulsation (a common complaint with the heavy Pilot). Use good quality pads & rotors and DIY. Like others said, YouTube is your friend.

I have my trusted mechanic flush the brake fluid every 3 yrs. It helps the Pilot's generally mushy pedal feel better.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
You could check the Chilton and Haynes site, It's probably going to be an online or subscription thing.




Love it. We really liked the 2013 Pilot Touring, but with just the wife and I it had a lot of features we didn't need, use including the rear entertainment system and the 3rd seat.

The Passport fits our lifestyle much better. Seating for 5 is quite adequate for us and the large rear cargo area is very nice. It also, being a Touring model it has the more rugged suspension of the top end Ridgeline. I do a bit of off roading, nothing heavy duty and appreciate the extra height over the Pilot.
Thank you for your reply.
I can relate to your description. The cargo area is almost as big as the Pilot and a Passport would be also a better fit for my needs and lifestyle.
For financial reasons, I am planning to keep the pilot for another 3 or four years.
In visiting again my question regarding the brake pads, It was interesting that you reached 71K miles and the front had still 4mm and back 5mm.
In my case with 56K miles, the dealer tech service indicates I have 3mm in the front and 5mm in the back. It seems strange since I would think the front would wear faster with more weight than the back. Do you predominantly drive on HWY? I do 65% city and 35% HWY, maybe that is a factor. Was maintenance done by the dealer or a private shop for your pilot?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
In most cases, pads can be changed without any rotor work. Cutting rotors in general is dumb. If they are 'out' and need cutting, it means they will be thinner in areas that get the most stress. Not to mention, you can buy and install aftermarket rotors like Centric for a lot less than service will charge for cutting.

After replacing pads, be sure to bed them. Go to some deserted road and do a series of accelerations followed by rapid braking (hard from 50+ mph to like 10) like 15-20 times, but never coming to a full stop. Then drive around normally a bit so brakes can cool off before you return home.
Thank you for your reply.
The dealer tech service indicates that 90% of time the rotors are cut because is better to avoid future vibrations and problems. My brakes in front/back do not vibrate. I am more inclined with you advice, specially if cutting makes them thinner.
When is absolutely necessary to cut rotors? and what could happen if just pads are replaced?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Watch any of the brake pad/disc replacement videos on the South Main Auto youtube channel.
There should be some for a Honda.
Be sure to check (and relube, if necessary) the caliper slide pins.
Thank you I will search.
 

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50/50, I predominantly drive the vehicle like I plan to keep it for a few years, not like i stole it. A lot of braking problems as well as other mechanical issues are driver related not vehicle related. Aggressive driving is one big culprit as is not understanding how various parts worked, One of our sons learned about warped rotors from water. He used to be an aggressive driver, and went through a deep puddle with hot rotors. "PING" they were warped. He no longer is an aggressive driver.

No I'm not the guy who goes 10 mph below the speed limit, but I learned long ago that when behind the wheel of a vehicle your main focus is on your driving. My situational awareness is such that I not only know the color of the traffic light I am approaching, I know the color of the lights further on that I can see.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Cutting rotors is becoming an obsolete practice. It leaves you with less metal to dissipate heat, which can quickly lead to pedal pulsation (a common complaint with the heavy Pilot). Use good quality pads & rotors and DIY. Like others said, YouTube is your friend.

I have my trusted mechanic flush the brake fluid every 3 yrs. It helps the Pilot's generally mushy pedal feel better.
It interesting that you mention that the brake pedal has a mushy feeling. Mine has been like that always. Is it because is air or humidity is trapped in the brake lines?
Have you replaced rotors and pads or can you just do pads?
Thank you for your reply.
 

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Thoughts:

-- I had "lifetime" pads on an SUV a decade or two ago. I'd do the routine inspections, and get new pads when they were less than about 5mm remaining. Store stopped the "lifetime" deal on new sales, but played along when I reminded them that they couldn't really cancel a warranty during the warranty period. Anyway, the guidance from the pad mfr (Raybestos) was that <2mm warranted replacement under warranty. <6mm recommended if it was my money buying them. So my 5mm threshold wasn't far off.

-- Cutting rotors is needed when they are damaged, otherwise cleaning old pad materials off can be done by hand with some sandpaper on a wood block. If they really are damaged to the point where you won't be able to bed new pads, they deserve replacement rather than machining. The Pilot rotors are really really cheap considering the duty, their life expectancy, etc. If in doubt, replace.

-- Spongy/musshy pedal or just a little low to engage? Does the pedal "pump up" if you press it a time or two before actually braking? Mine does. "Modern" caliper pistons and slides/pins are configured to retract completely clear of the rotor surface with pedal up. The amount of retraction is related to the design of the seals on those caliper pistons, and not easily changed. The pins/slides need to stay lubricated so they slide easily, rather than having them stick and pull the pads back instead of releasing. Owners would do well to make sure that these parts are kept clean and lubricated. You can buy "caliper slide grease", and use it -sparingly- on the contact surfaces. Easy to clean those surfaces to new grease on some kind of schedule. Mine get done with annual "spring cleaning", done after winter when the springs get dirty.

-- Brake fluid gets replaced at least every other year, flushed/replaced with full system bleed. I have a Motive-style power bleeder for the toys, but haven't made a reservoir fitting yet to use it on the Pilot. Probably should.... Doing it the old-fashioned way so far. Just need a couple big washers and a QD fitting I already have. One of these days. The Pilot bleeds easily by the conventional method. Just Do It!
 

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Thank you for your reply.
The dealer tech service indicates that 90% of time the rotors are cut because is better to avoid future vibrations and problems. My brakes in front/back do not vibrate. I am more inclined with you advice, specially if cutting makes them thinner.
When is absolutely necessary to cut rotors? and what could happen if just pads are replaced?
Dealer tech service wants your $$$. To avoid future vibrations/problems, you need to take the car out and bed the fresh pads. Procedure applies an even layer of pad material to rotors. Vibrating brakes, you can almost always see the pad imprint someplace on the rotor, when car with hot new pads was allowed to come to complete stop. If you need to drive before you can do this, avoid full stops. I.e. at traffic light, slow down almost to a stop in advance, and then keep the car rolling slowly.

If your brakes do not vibrate, your rotors are just fine.

When absolutely necessary to cut = NEVER. If you have vibrating brakes, and/or rotors have visible gouges, replace them. Dealer will often charge you over $100 per wheel for resurfacing. Even premium rotors cost like $40-50 each on Rockauto, and in most cases are better than OEM. I been doing my brakes myself since 2005, always replacing just the pads, only needed to replace rotors once. You just need some decent wrenches/sockets, a good torque wrench that can do 27, 75 and 94 ft/lbs, caliper spreader, pin grease, brake quiet. For rotor removal, an impact screwdriver is VERY useful.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Thank you for your advice. I will replace brake pads only. If necessary I will put new disk brakes later.
I am at over 56K miles now and I have been using the dealer services to maintain the car and documenting all services with the thought that if I were going to trade it and sell the Pilot it would keep higher value if properly maintained by Honda dealer.
At this point, (with warranty expired) it looks like I will drive it for another 3 or 4 more years.
Probably having the dealer shop for service is not a good option. Dealer mission is more to support new sales than support devoted car owners. My dilemma and challenge is now how to find a trusted shop and a reliable mechanic.
Definitely It has been a great step to recently join the Piloteers community.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Thoughts:

-- I had "lifetime" pads on an SUV a decade or two ago. I'd do the routine inspections, and get new pads when they were less than about 5mm remaining. Store stopped the "lifetime" deal on new sales, but played along when I reminded them that they couldn't really cancel a warranty during the warranty period. Anyway, the guidance from the pad mfr (Raybestos) was that <2mm warranted replacement under warranty. <6mm recommended if it was my money buying them. So my 5mm threshold wasn't far off.

-- Cutting rotors is needed when they are damaged, otherwise cleaning old pad materials off can be done by hand with some sandpaper on a wood block. If they really are damaged to the point where you won't be able to bed new pads, they deserve replacement rather than machining. The Pilot rotors are really really cheap considering the duty, their life expectancy, etc. If in doubt, replace.

-- Spongy/musshy pedal or just a little low to engage? Does the pedal "pump up" if you press it a time or two before actually braking? Mine does. "Modern" caliper pistons and slides/pins are configured to retract completely clear of the rotor surface with pedal up. The amount of retraction is related to the design of the seals on those caliper pistons, and not easily changed. The pins/slides need to stay lubricated so they slide easily, rather than having them stick and pull the pads back instead of releasing. Owners would do well to make sure that these parts are kept clean and lubricated. You can buy "caliper slide grease", and use it -sparingly- on the contact surfaces. Easy to clean those surfaces to new grease on some kind of schedule. Mine get done with annual "spring cleaning", done after winter when the springs get dirty.

-- Brake fluid gets replaced at least every other year, flushed/replaced with full system bleed. I have a Motive-style power bleeder for the toys, but haven't made a reservoir fitting yet to use it on the Pilot. Probably should.... Doing it the old-fashioned way so far. Just need a couple big washers and a QD fitting I already have. One of these days. The Pilot bleeds easily by the conventional method. Just Do It!
Thoughts:

-- I had "lifetime" pads on an SUV a decade or two ago. I'd do the routine inspections, and get new pads when they were less than about 5mm remaining. Store stopped the "lifetime" deal on new sales, but played along when I reminded them that they couldn't really cancel a warranty during the warranty period. Anyway, the guidance from the pad mfr (Raybestos) was that <2mm warranted replacement under warranty. <6mm recommended if it was my money buying them. So my 5mm threshold wasn't far off.

-- Cutting rotors is needed when they are damaged, otherwise cleaning old pad materials off can be done by hand with some sandpaper on a wood block. If they really are damaged to the point where you won't be able to bed new pads, they deserve replacement rather than machining. The Pilot rotors are really really cheap considering the duty, their life expectancy, etc. If in doubt, replace.

-- Spongy/musshy pedal or just a little low to engage? Does the pedal "pump up" if you press it a time or two before actually braking? Mine does. "Modern" caliper pistons and slides/pins are configured to retract completely clear of the rotor surface with pedal up. The amount of retraction is related to the design of the seals on those caliper pistons, and not easily changed. The pins/slides need to stay lubricated so they slide easily, rather than having them stick and pull the pads back instead of releasing. Owners would do well to make sure that these parts are kept clean and lubricated. You can buy "caliper slide grease", and use it -sparingly- on the contact surfaces. Easy to clean those surfaces to new grease on some kind of schedule. Mine get done with annual "spring cleaning", done after winter when the springs get dirty.

-- Brake fluid gets replaced at least every other year, flushed/replaced with full system bleed. I have a Motive-style power bleeder for the toys, but haven't made a reservoir fitting yet to use it on the Pilot. Probably should.... Doing it the old-fashioned way so far. Just need a couple big washers and a QD fitting I already have. One of these days. The Pilot bleeds easily by the conventional method. Just Do It!
I am not sure I replied to your message, thank you for the detailed explanation.
 

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Check your service manual and see if your model year has the same brake bleeding order some previous years have, like my 2006, which is front driver's corner first, then clockwise. Post what it says here.

It's not a typical bleeding order, and I've had this "conversation" with a mechanic who was saying that what he learned in mechanic school was to start with the farthest, etc., etc., and he ought to know better than me, so I printed the attached excerpt.

Don't know if it was because it was done my way (well, Honda's engineering team's way), and/or the Centric brake and rotor set I got, but for two years now I've been very happy (and safe) with not having to preplan my stops because of the soft, mushy brakes so many Piloteers complain of, like I used to.
 

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