Honda Pilot - Honda Pilot Forums banner

1 - 20 of 28 Posts

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This car (2011 EX-L, around 230K km on the ODO) that my wife is driving has been driving me nuts.
It has this shimmy around 120 KMH which is more pronounced on better pavements than crappy ones. It feels like it waddles side-to-side. There's a very light vibration even when parked and idling, and it doesn't manifest itself again until the vehicle hits 120. Never happens at 110 and below. Somewhat goes away after 130. Happens regardless of the ECO mode.
It did blow 3d Cylinder spark plug on me a month ago or so, but the shimmy was there before and didn't go away after I replaced the spark plug.

Wheel balancing helps a little, but one day later it comes back.
Front end has new lower arms, new dampers, new sway bar bushings and links, and new tie rods. No improvement after all of this was replaced.

Rear end has new dampers and sway bar bushings/links. No improvement after replacement.

Transmission support has been replaced. Engine mounts seem to be fine, no error codes, no signs of them leaking or being loose. Prop shaft U-joints seem to be OK. Wheel hub bearings have no play.

Why, dear Lord, why does the damn thing do this to me?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
120 Posts
mine has been shaking for years, I've done much of the stuff you have, except for the struts and tie rod ends. I think it got a little better when I recently did front end links.

my daughter drives it now, its got 210000 miles and keeps on shakkkkkking
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,383 Posts
This car (2011 EX-L, around 230K km on the ODO) that my wife is driving has been driving me nuts.
It has this shimmy around 120 KMH which is more pronounced on better pavements than crappy ones. It feels like it waddles side-to-side. There's a very light vibration even when parked and idling, and it doesn't manifest itself again until the vehicle hits 120. Never happens at 110 and below. Somewhat goes away after 130. Happens regardless of the ECO mode.
It did blow 3d Cylinder spark plug on me a month ago or so, but the shimmy was there before and didn't go away after I replaced the spark plug.

Wheel balancing helps a little, but one day later it comes back.
Front end has new lower arms, new dampers, new sway bar bushings and links, and new tie rods. No improvement after all of this was replaced.

Rear end has new dampers and sway bar bushings/links. No improvement after replacement.

Transmission support has been replaced. Engine mounts seem to be fine, no error codes, no signs of them leaking or being loose. Prop shaft U-joints seem to be OK. Wheel hub bearings have no play.

Why, dear Lord, why does the damn thing do this to me?
Worn CV axles can cause shaking. Have they ever been replaced?
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
OK, a Mechanic I trust is convinced that this is the dreaded Honda transmission shudder.
He test drive it for almost an entire day today, and once he said that the gears are slipping.
It does shake pretty consistently around 110-120km. And one other thing is when braking it does jerk a bit, but I though it was more of a braking issue.
Any real way to confirm? And what’s the real sequence of troubleshooting? Is it worth doing the three flushes and a full at this time? Do I do the torque converter? Or am I in for a new tranny at this point?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,383 Posts
Yes!
I would try to avoid an expensive repair by replacing the transmission fluid 3 times using Full Synthetic Valvoline MaxLife ATF. The thinner fluid should help it. It will flow through the internal filter better.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,957 Posts
OK, a Mechanic I trust is convinced that this is the dreaded Honda transmission shudder.
He test drive it for almost an entire day today, and once he said that the gears are slipping.
It does shake pretty consistently around 110-120km. And one other thing is when braking it does jerk a bit, but I though it was more of a braking issue.
Any real way to confirm? And what’s the real sequence of troubleshooting? Is it worth doing the three flushes and a full at this time? Do I do the torque converter? Or am I in for a new tranny at this point?
Take care of the trans shudder as described by @Nail Grease first as that will dictate the direction of subsequent repair(s). Then proceed towards the vibration issue that may have different culprits relative to the Pilot age and mileage.
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Thanks. I'll try that. What bothers me a bit is that yesterday, while test driving it myself, I'd get it to vibrate, and immediately shift to Neutral, but the vibrations would not go away.

Valvoline MaxLife ATF
To double-check: the process is to replace the original DW-1 fluid with Valvoline MaxLife ATF three times over a course of 2 weeks, correct?
I've also read about people having their control modules reprogrammed by Honda, should I attempt it first you think?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,383 Posts
Thanks. I'll try that. What bothers me a bit is that yesterday, while test driving it myself, I'd get it to vibrate, and immediately shift to Neutral, but the vibrations would not go away.
If it's a constant vibration at any speed, have you check your wheel bearings?
 

·
Read Only
Joined
·
187 Posts
There were problems with bad compliance bushing that caused vibrations. My were repaired under recall. Bad ones look like this..
137715
 

Attachments

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
If it's a constant vibration at any speed, have you check your wheel bearings?
No, it starts around 110-120 kmh now and goes away at 105 and below, and is less pronounced after 130. No "droning" noise either. When I wrote that the vibrations wouldn;t go away, I meant that from the time I switched to N at around 120 kmh and until the car coasted down to 105 or so in a few seconds, the vibrations stayed there.
I checked and rechecked all wheel bearings countless times now, as that's what I thought was causing it. Had the front ones fail at 60K kms and replaced under warranty and rear ones are still original but show no play whatsoever.
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
There were problems with bad compliance bushing that caused vibrations. My were repaired under recall. Bad ones look like this..
No, as I stated, the entire front-end has been redone by now, including complete control arms, as well as rear-end dampers and sway bar bushings/links and it didn't help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,383 Posts
Then I believe your rear and/or front engine mount(s) may be bad. They do not have to be torn to be bad. The vibration at certain rpms is a symptom. You can test these. After your vehicle has reached operating temperature, with your left foot on the brake (firmly, do not release), put your vehicle in drive and gently press on the accelerator with your right foot. If you hear knocking, you have a bad engine mount. The same test can be done in reverse. You can also have someone observe if the engine is raising up out of it cradle when accelerating.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Daltongang

·
Registered
Joined
·
866 Posts
I didn't see in your list either tire swap fronts for backs, or anyone checking for radial or axial run out of the tire/wheel assy. For the wobble feeling, and a vibration that is speed sensitive between 60 and 80 mph, e, most mechanics would look at outer tie rod ends, steering rack bushings, lower control arm bushings, tire/wheel runout, subframe bushings, engine mounts. You eliminated many these, but have they all?
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I didn't see in your list either tire swap fronts for backs, or anyone checking for radial or axial run out of the tire/wheel assy. For the wobble feeling, and a vibration that is speed sensitive between 60 and 80 mph, e, most mechanics would look at outer tie rod ends, steering rack bushings, lower control arm bushings, tire/wheel runout, subframe bushings, engine mounts. You eliminated many these, but have they all?
This has been going on for 1 year or more at this point. It vibrates even with brand new tires and countless balancing/rebalancing.
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Tested the engine supports again. The only part that really bothers me is the shudder at first switch from P to D and less pronounced when going D back to P, in the first seconds of the video.
The engine is lifting when revving up in gear, whether in D or R, but I've seen that before. Not hearing any knocking at all.
Video here:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,383 Posts
Tested the engine supports again. The only part that really bothers me is the shudder at first switch from P to D and less pronounced when going D back to P, in the first seconds of the video.
The engine is lifting when revving up in gear, whether in D or R, but I've seen that before. Not hearing any knocking at all.
Video here:
Your back mount is more loose than the front.
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Right. Got Honda test-drive it for a day and they want me to replace the rear mount. Gonna try that, parts incoming.

Looks a bit involved, dropping exhaust pipe, RH driveshaft intermediate shaft, and the cat.
Now when it comes to intermediate shaft removal - I'm OK to do it without draining the ATF, right?
The shop manual says drain, but it says so for any drive shaft removal, and I've done the driver's side driveshaft without draining and losing so much as a drop of ATF.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,383 Posts
Right. Got Honda test-drive it for a day and they want me to replace the rear mount. Gonna try that, parts incoming.

Looks a bit involved, dropping exhaust pipe, RH driveshaft intermediate shaft, and the cat.
Now when it comes to intermediate shaft removal - I'm OK to do it without draining the ATF, right?
The shop manual says drain, but it says so for any drive shaft removal, and I've done the driver's side driveshaft without draining and losing so much as a drop of ATF.
Yes, you loose some ATF. Just be ready with a pan. I guess draining it is more clean and they can charge you for the service.
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Yes, you loose some ATF. Just be ready with a pan. I guess draining it is more clean and they can charge you for the service.
Yup. They quoted CAD1200 for the job. I bought all OEM parts, including bolts, gaskets, and any components marked as "replace" and any pieces I think will be too crudded to put back in for CAD400. The rest is labor (I'm guessing they included 4-5 hrs), ATF change, and, probably, alignment check.
Doing it myself, though, not much available cash at hand due to COVID. Not looking forward to it, definitely.
 

·
Registered
2011 Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
144 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
OK, so, I made an honest effort to work on it myself and jacked it up, and then had one close look and said "fuck this crap, I'll just pay someone $400 to fuck around this on my behalf". I mean, come on, take off passenger driveshaft, intermediate shaft, exhaust pipe A, and a cat and even then all you get is barely enough space to work on it if you are a Laparoscopy Surgeon. You gotta be kidding me here.

But in the meantime I also diagnosed the intermediate driveshaft seal failure, so, will have to attend to that. Boggles my mind that 2 Mechanics looked at it on 2 separate occasions and not one of them was able to see it.

Currently leaning towards just replacing it rather than rebuilding.
IMG_0601.JPG
138147
 
1 - 20 of 28 Posts
Top