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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
2012 EX-L 4WD: I recently removed the lower plastic vanity shield under the front bumper cover and noticed an oil spot on the top side of it right under the front engine mount. Uh-oh. So, I do so see oil on the mount. But I did a quick test to see if the engine moved when in gear with the brake on and a little gas ... and no excessive movement. I also see oil ABOVE the mount on the two connectors up under the front bank wire harness. But it's only in that one spot. New PCV and EGR. No, I didn't spill any oil changing them. These mounts don't squirt oil upwards when they compress, do they?

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If the rubber is torn or cracked, leaking fluid, it should be replaced.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 · (Edited)
If the rubber is torn or cracked, leaking fluid, it should be replaced.
I can't see any cracks although it's difficult to see the whole thing without taking it out or removing stuff in the way. There doesn't appear to be that much oil, not like oil is dripping on the floor.. Do you happen to know about how much oil these mounts hold? It doesn't seem to be spec'd anywhere, maybe because changing motor mount oil isn't a maintenance item.:unsure:

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Compliance bushings, motor mounts, what else is fluid filled that can leak on these things? What happened to rubber and polyurethane as the bushing/mount isolators of choice?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 · (Edited)
Compliance bushings, motor mounts, what else is fluid filled that can leak on these things? What happened to rubber and polyurethane as the bushing/mount isolators of choice?
Maybe they needed somewhere to get rid of all that dysfunctional Z1 oil that that was replaced by the dysfunctional DW-1 oil that will be replace with Rev 3.1. I think some guys that worked for Microsoft in the Windows department are now at Honda Transmission Oil department. Maybe oil dripping on your garage floor is their version of a dash CEL for failing mounts and bushings. CM&B light, err drip warning.
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Compliance bushings, motor mounts, what else is fluid filled that can leak on these things? What happened to rubber and polyurethane as the bushing/mount isolators of choice?
What happened? They can’t charge $500 per mount unless they fill them with SOMETHING.
 
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What happened? They can’t charge $500 per mount unless they fill them with SOMETHING.
Truth. And unlike our classic cars where a motor mount can be changed in 15 mins this will be a 4 hour job. With broken bolts or stripped threads I'm sure. It always amazes me how 60 year old hardware never breaks or strips but 7 year old hardware will.
 
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Truth. And unlike our classic cars where a motor mount can be changed in 15 mins this will be a 4 hour job. With broken bolts or stripped threads I'm sure. It always amazes me how 60 year old hardware never breaks or strips but 7 year old hardware will.
It seems like they use such soft metal these days. What’s really sad is I think the old school solid mounts worked better too. Only reason we got these monstrosities is because Honda HAD to give us VCM. It’s like almost everything bad about these cars links back to their hack to save 0.5 mpg.
 

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Just looking at the photo, your engine mount looks spotless. Is it possible that it's engine oil or ATF? There are a ATF lines in that vicinity, going in and out of the radiator.
 

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It seems like they use such soft metal these days. What’s really sad is I think the old school solid mounts worked better too. Only reason we got these monstrosities is because Honda HAD to give us VCM. It’s like almost everything bad about these cars links back to their hack to save 0.5 mpg.
VCM sure doesn't help, but back in the classic car days so many of them were straight 6 or V8, which are both pretty balanced designs. I can tell you my '61 Impala with a 283 and a mild cam and even my dad's '69 Camaro with a built 350 really don't exhibit poor engine NVH. Some of the Caddys of the day were so smooth with solid mounts. But now we have 4 cylinders and V6s combined with cylinder deactivation and other technologies that result in poor NVH, so we get fluid filled and sometimes even active mounts (the mounts have wires and I guess they can stiffen or soften the mount based on conditions).
 
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VCM sure doesn't help, but back in the classic car days so many of them were straight 6 or V8, which are both pretty balanced designs. I can tell you my '61 Impala with a 283 and a mild cam and even my dad's '69 Camaro with a built 350 really don't exhibit poor engine NVH. Some of the Caddys of the day were so smooth with solid mounts. But now we have 4 cylinders and V6s combined with cylinder deactivation and other technologies that result in poor NVH, so we get fluid filled and sometimes even active mounts (the mounts have wires and I guess they can stiffen or soften the mount based on conditions).
Yep - and our V6 engines with dumb tech still likely get worse gas mileage than if the thing had just come with a pushrod ls1. I don’t get it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
It seems like they use such soft metal these days. What’s really sad is I think the old school solid mounts worked better too. Only reason we got these monstrosities is because Honda HAD to give us VCM. It’s like almost everything bad about these cars links back to their hack to save 0.5 mpg.
Cheap Chinese steel.
Honda didn't give us VCM. Your friendly government did. And enjoy it now, because things are going to get even worse. Just think, some day, you'll actually appreciate saving 0.5 mpg when the price of fossil fuels gets high enough.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
Just looking at the photo, your engine mount looks spotless. Is it possible that it's engine oil or ATF? There are a ATF lines in that vicinity, going in and out of the radiator.
Hmmm, first thing I checked were engine oil and atf fluid levels. All up to full, although what I saw on the vanity shield wasn't very much oil at all. And now that I removed the shield, I don't see any on the garage floor. It's like whatever was leaking, either healed or ran out.

I wouldn't know a spotless motor mount from a kangaroo, but thanks for the reassurance. I'll keep looking. Hopefully it's something easier and less expensive to fix than a motor mount. To be honest, I never would have known if I hadn't taken off that shield looking for the PCV metal grommet that fell in the engine bay. I actually found some tools I don't own down there.
 

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Cheap Chinese steel.
Honda didn't give us VCM. Your friendly government did. And enjoy it now, because things are going to get even worse. Just think, some day, you'll actually appreciate saving 0.5 mpg when the price of fossil fuels gets high enough.
Yes and no... I agree the gov't pushed Honda to do it... but other manufactures solved the problem in different ways that seem to work better.

I'll go electric once the re-charging times come down enough until then it'll be whatever they charge for gas. Half tempted to get an exceedingly "fun" gas car while they're still readily available. Lots of power + manual transmission will be a true collectors item some day.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Yes and no... I agree the gov't pushed Honda to do it... but other manufactures solved the problem in different ways that seem to work better.

I'll go electric once the re-charging times come down enough until then it'll be whatever they charge for gas. Half tempted to get an exceedingly "fun" gas car while they're still readily available. Lots of power + manual transmission will be a true collectors item some day.
Like who? Toyota? Keep in mind, there are a lot of people who aren't having a bad time with Honda VCM. We just see a lot of them that are because Google searches on VCM problems scoot them in here. Also keep in mind, for less than a $100 you can permanently rid your car of VCM, so you have no grounds to complain when the solution is so easy and affordable.

If the car manufacturers had to put in and maintain all the gas stations, we'd still be using horses and buggies. The electric companies are the ones that stand to gain from putting in charging stations. But they can't even maintain the existing grid, so don't hold your breath. Plus, I don't see battery technology in sight yet that will recharge a 300 mile battery in the few minutes it takes to fill a tank with gasoline. What I do see as a possible solution are like the LP gas bottle exchange cages at Lowe's and some supermarkets. Some kind of mechanize battery exchange machine that can handle the weight of the battery and put in a fully charged one after you slide your credit card. If Carvana can put up all those car vending machines, battery vending machines ought to be a piece of cake. I better patent this idea as soon as I can.
 

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Yes and no... I agree the gov't pushed Honda to do it... but other manufactures solved the problem in different ways that seem to work better.

I'll go electric once the re-charging times come down enough until then it'll be whatever they charge for gas. Half tempted to get an exceedingly "fun" gas car while they're still readily available. Lots of power + manual transmission will be a true collectors item some day.
I'm with you... also my wife never wants to get rid of the Pilot but in 2-5 years if a decent three row electric is available (and priced close enough to three rows, minimum 200 mile range) I could certainly be convinced to go that route. My commute is 3 miles, even with daycare drop off and pickup and lunch driving I'm maybe 25 miles per day.
 
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Like who? Toyota? Keep in mind, there are a lot of people who aren't having a bad time with Honda VCM. We just see a lot of them that are because Google searches on VCM problems scoot them in here. Also keep in mind, for less than a $100 you can permanently rid your car of VCM, so you have no grounds to complain when the solution is so easy and affordable.

If the car manufacturers had to put in and maintain all the gas stations, we'd still be using horses and buggies. The electric companies are the ones that stand to gain from putting in charging stations. But they can't even maintain the existing grid, so don't hold your breath. Plus, I don't see battery technology in sight yet that will recharge a 300 mile battery in the few minutes it takes to fill a tank with gasoline. What I do see as a possible solution are like the LP gas bottle exchange cages at Lowe's and some supermarkets. Some kind of mechanize battery exchange machine that can handle the weight of the battery and put in a fully charged one after you slide your credit card. If Carvana can put up all those car vending machines, battery vending machines ought to be a piece of cake. I better patent this idea as soon as I can.
Tesla was proposing that idea, I don't know if they ever piloted the program or just left it as a concept. Like you said, the idea is sound but the details and nuances could be a nightmare.
 
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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
Tesla was proposing that idea, I don't know if they ever piloted the program or just left it as a concept. Like you said, the idea is sound but the details and nuances could be a nightmare.
Well, maybe not. All the existing gas stations have electric power. Most all have hydraulic lifts. There's enough of them now to make an adequate network of recharging stations or battery exchange stations. Eventually the big oil companies will need a way to make a living in an oiless world. Lord knows they have the capital to make the switchover if properly motivated. But it needs to be done smart and gradually, not the economically destructive knee jerk way being currently attempted. We've heard the phony predictions of the pending end of the world too many times to believe them anymore, but a realistic plan is needed to do it right in a reasonable amount of time without crashing world economies. Poverty and going without food will kill you a lot quicker than global warming.
 

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Like who? Toyota? Keep in mind, there are a lot of people who aren't having a bad time with Honda VCM. We just see a lot of them that are because Google searches on VCM problems scoot them in here. Also keep in mind, for less than a $100 you can permanently rid your car of VCM, so you have no grounds to complain when the solution is so easy and affordable.
Toyota? Yeah - they're an example of a company that has done well without cylinder deactivation. I have plenty of grounds to complain. I suffered with VCM for a long time despite never having any engine damage. We bought our Pilot new and VCM bothered me after about 6 months once everything started "wearing in" and it became noticeable. My dealer said I was far from the only person complaining about it but that everything I was complaining about was "normal" and nothing to be fixed. They said they wished they had an option to turn it off. This was before there was a magical $100 device that would turn it off. Today? Sure no big deal. In 2013 and 2014? I was filling out customer feedback forms vowing to never buy another Honda vehicle because of it. With that said my wife never even noticed it. She didn't notice our bad CV axle either. So yes - some other manufactures have solved the fuel economy problem "better" than Honda did, AND I've owned ours long enough that I absolutely have grounds to complain.
 
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