Honda Pilot - Honda Pilot Forums banner

1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
373 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I've read quite a bit about the Pilot's AWD system.
I understand the VTM lock and how the system is supposed to work.

I've been in a number of situations (typically during acceleration in on wet pavement) where the front tire or tires seem to just spin with a torque steer type of pulling of the wheel. The Pilot does move but it's not what I would expect.
Other times there is limited wheelspin.
I replaced a V8 Mountaineer, with it I could floor it and the truck would just accelerate, no wheelspin at all.
On my wife's Highlander, traction control kicks in cutting engine power, but no wheelspin.
My understanding is that the rear wheels are engaged when starting out always and then they cut back power as needed.

Does this seem normal to anyone else?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
168 Posts
Bill,
The VTM-4 is a proactive system. The rear axle is only engaged if the system "thinks" that there will be front wheel spin. Otherwise, it is a front wheel drive, start to finish.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
128 Posts
You also can select to engage the AWD.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
262 Posts
I noticed the same thing today on a wet pavement:
there was a split second of spin at the front, then
it felt the rear kicked in. However, theory says this should
not have happen -- the rear should have been engaged the
whole time! I think the answer is -- the rear WAS engaged
somewhat, just not enough for the wet pavement, so
the system transfered more torque to the back once the
front wheel spin started. That would make sense, however
that still mean you have to spin before you go :( I am
curious just how smart the control system is -- does it
"learn" the road conditions, or will it spin first every time
before it transfers more torque to the back wheels?!
I am sure we'll have plent of opportunity to experiment
this winter, but I am curious what has the experience
been on the MDX.

BillR said:
I've read quite a bit about the Pilot's AWD system.
I understand the VTM lock and how the system is supposed to work.

I've been in a number of situations (typically during acceleration in on wet pavement) where the front tire or tires seem to just spin with a torque steer type of pulling of the wheel. The Pilot does move but it's not what I would expect.
Other times there is limited wheelspin.
I replaced a V8 Mountaineer, with it I could floor it and the truck would just accelerate, no wheelspin at all.
On my wife's Highlander, traction control kicks in cutting engine power, but no wheelspin.
My understanding is that the rear wheels are engaged when starting out always and then they cut back power as needed.

Does this seem normal to anyone else?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
373 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Thank you for the replies.
Here's a link to Honda's website.
http://www.hondacars.com/models/engineering.asp?ModelName=Pilot

According to this information, there should never be wheelspin. However, there is.
The system does operate in 2wd at higher speeds but is supposed to be anticipating wheelspin when starting out and that's where I'm having trouble.

The AWD engage "VTM Lock", can only be used in 1st, 2nd, or reverse settings at speeds below 18mph and on loose surfaces.

I think Kruzo's on the right track, the rear wheels are powered but not enough to feel.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,140 Posts
Remember when your wheels are turned your front and back axle speed is never the same, so the lightest loaded wheel will always slip some. Just don't step so hard on the gas.
4WD does not let you violate the laws of nature.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
920 Posts
I would agree with N_Jay...I think that if you floored your Pilot in wet or snow, you will get temporary wheel spin. The only time I got spin was when it very hot and humid out and it just started raining. The roads were pretty greasy at the time and my fronts slipped for a split second. I have never experienced spin on dry pavement.

Has anyone had any experience with Audi’s Quattro system???
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,262 Posts
My wife's A4 has Quattro, and I don't think I've ever felt noticable wheel spin under most circumstances. I've floored it on wet and snow-packed streets, and it just goes! They may spin in deep snow, most likely due to the low ground clearance, and the car is bottoming out / surfing up on the snow. We've never become stuck, but then again use common sense in winter driving. We had fun putting it to the test during our first winter with the car, and were very impressed. We're still impressed 3.5 years later. I love driving that car! (Almost as much as I love my Pilot!) It is a 1.8T though, so the turbo isn't delivering full power at launch.

The only time the tires have made any noise is at about 55 - 60 mph on a curving exit ramp. (Speed Limit 35) And then it was just a howl at the limit of adhesion. :eek:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
920 Posts
Minneapolis winters will be a great playground to test the Pilot's AWD system.

The only real experience I've had going off road is when I was hauling some 2500 lbs. of brush to the waste yard. It was raining super hard and there was tons of standing water and soupy mud. As we waited for the rain to subside before we unloaded the trailer, I was getting a bit nervous about getting the Pilot and trailer turned around and out of this mud. Anyway, when we finished unloading the trailer, we started out in regular D mode and had absolutely no problem getting through the mud and water. In fact, the mud was so soupy that as we were turning around to leave the yard, I could feel the rear wheels pushing through the mud because the fronts were not getting enough traction...tire design, etc.

I can’t wait to see how this thing does in winter…
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
373 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
I do understand traction very well.
The area I live in has some very short highway onramps.
I have no intention of pulling out in front of oncoming traffic without being able to go. I went to AWD to give me added traction in all weather. Not invincibility. I've had 4wd for years.

I'm going from a vehicle that I could just floor it (with a lot more torque than the Pilot) and it would just go, even in snow.
If it were for traction only I would've kept it.
Our Highlander cuts power when wheels spin but it always has AWD engaged so it doesn't happen a lot (it still goes though).
When I stomp on the gas it just goes (even in the snow).
I expect my Pilot to do the same.
If this is normal for the Pilot, I will have to adapt to it (and it will be my last one).
If it's not normal I want to get it fixed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
288 Posts
QUESTION ABOUT AWD

I wonder if in this snow season,since snow will be everywhere,if the system is engaged to all wheel drive ,will it stay engaged continuoesly until the vehicle stops(I mean the distance the car will travel with AWD on)Anyone has any idea?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
123 Posts
Re: QUESTION ABOUT AWD

baoloclamdong said:
I wonder if in this snow season,since snow will be everywhere,if the system is engaged to all wheel drive ,will it stay engaged continuoesly until the vehicle stops(I mean the distance the car will travel with AWD on)Anyone has any idea?
The system only kicks in if the VTM-4 computer detects wheel slippage at the front wheels. It automatically disengages when slippage is no longer detected. The VTM-4 can be engaged manually, but only in 1st and 2nd gear under 18 mph.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
919 Posts
Re: Re: QUESTION ABOUT AWD

ontheverge said:


The VTM-4 can be engaged manually, but only in 1st and 2nd gear under 18 mph.
It can also be engaged in reverse.

Chris
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
123 Posts
Re: Re: Re: QUESTION ABOUT AWD

xyzzy said:


It can also be engaged in reverse.

Chris
Thanks! I did not know that. Makes sense, though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
373 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Thanks, I forgot to include reverse.

I'm beginning to think the AWD system is working the way it's supposed to.

I'm sure the system with VTM lock engaged will be fine.
It's the rest of the time it concerns me.

I read a Car and Driver report that says Acura is adding more power to the rear wheels of the MDX for 2003.
http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Cara...hec/200210_cthec_acura.xml?Manufacturer=Acura

The Pilot is based on the current AWD system used in the MDX.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
310 Posts
I wonder if the additional power to the rear axel is something that can be changed in previous models with a simple chip/software change or if the additional power is a result of something mechanically different about the 03 X.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
920 Posts
More automotive BS

The MDX gets an injection of power in the 3.5-liter V-6 (it now makes 260 hp). There's also a new five-speed automatic, and a new all-wheel-drive system sends more torque to the rear axle. A stability-control system is standard. A DVD entertainment system and a rearview camera are optional.

This is the type of stuff that kinda annoys me...

1. 20 more hp...no big deal

2. New five-speed tranny??? What is different? Does that mean that the Pilot has the old, crappy tranny???

3. New AWD system??? Same questions as asked in #2.

The more I read the more I'm starting to feel like the people that bought the initial CRV that has been revamped like 112 times!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
262 Posts
Re: More automotive BS

MG Pilot said:
The more I read the more I'm starting to feel like
the people that bpught the initial CRV that has been revamped like 112 times! [/B]
Have you considered a 12 month lease?;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
So, if I understand this whole VTM-4 system correctly:

1) When front wheel slippage is detected, then some degree of torque is applied to the rear wheels?

2) The VTM system can apply torque to the rear wheels at any speed?

3) The driver can manualy engage ("lock") the VTM system at speeds slower than 18 mph AND ou must be in gear 1, 2 or reverse manaually and not via the D mode?

Just trying to understand this system and know its limitatations and capabilities. When driving from Cincinnati to Pittsburgh 2 days before Thanksgiving, we ran into a bad snow storm on I-70 outside of Wheeling, WV. The Pilot's rear end felt kinda slippy, like any front wheel driver car does in the snow and it wasn't the feel I was expecting. Now I was running at a high speed at that moment (appox 50 - 60 or so) and when I slowed down it felt ok. Maybe the tires too?

But when I pressed on the gas at any high speed (i.e. over 18 mph) I didn't get any feel other than I was in a fWD car.
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
Top