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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I am doing 2nd timing belt change due to failed tensioner. So went to align everything and belt was skipping without notice. Cams were out the same amount so I moved them So now I have both cams with tdc marks at 12 o clock but my crank tdc Mark is at 6 o clock. I am freaking out guys, please help. I have no idea how many times cams and crank rotated.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 · (Edited)
I am doing 2nd timing belt change due to failed tensioner. So went to align everything and belt was skipping without notice. Cams were out the same amount so I moved them So now I have both cams with tdc marks at 12 o clock but my crank tdc Mark is at 6 o clock. I am freaking out guys, please help. I have no idea how many times cams and crank rotated.
Ok, I was able to move the cams and crank so all are pointing to their tdc marks. Does this mean that timing is fine or Am I missing something else
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
If each cam is on the TDC mark and the crank is on the TDC mark it is timed correctly.
I just want to make sure. After turning the crank thinking that I was also turning the cams I find out belt is skipping in the process. So now crank tdc Mark is at , let’s say 9 o clock, rear cam is at 6 o clock and front is at 2 o clock. I tried to rotate crank to realign it to tdc and it is hitting resistance so I move up to cams. I turn cams to tdc fighting the spring action that makes them want to spring forward or backwards to keep them both at tdc. I then go back to crank and turn it , now with no resistance to tdc. Now everything is at tdc. Is there any possibility of error here due to the 2 to 1 turn ratio of crank to cams?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Ok, thanks for the reply huntertn. This is more for me clarity wise as I can’t afford to mess this up. If the timing belt is off of the engine, is it at all possible to have your cams and your crank with all pulley markings pointing straight up and still have the timing off and kill your engine? Call it paranoid or ocd, I do not care, I fucked up and need to get our kid hauler back on the road.
 

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Wish I could help, but this is above my level of competence. Wish I could provide more than just moral support. Stand by, though; there are some great knowledgeable and helpful people on this forum and I'm sure you'll get an answer.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Wish I could help, but this is above my level of competence. Wish I could provide more than just moral support. Stand by, though; there are some great knowledgeable and helpful people on this forum and I'm sure you'll get an answer.
Hey , I really appreciate you chiming in. All the best to you.
 

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Ok, thanks for the reply huntertn. This is more for me clarity wise as I can’t afford to mess this up. If the timing belt is off of the engine, is it at all possible to have your cams and your crank with all pulley markings pointing straight up and still have the timing off and kill your engine? Call it paranoid or ocd, I do not care, I fucked up and need to get our kid hauler back on the road.
see what Nail Grease wrote its a better answer
 
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I just want to make sure. After turning the crank thinking that I was also turning the cams I find out belt is skipping in the process. So now crank tdc Mark is at , let’s say 9 o clock, rear cam is at 6 o clock and front is at 2 o clock. I tried to rotate crank to realign it to tdc and it is hitting resistance so I move up to cams. I turn cams to tdc fighting the spring action that makes them want to spring forward or backwards to keep them both at tdc. I then go back to crank and turn it , now with no resistance to tdc. Now everything is at tdc. Is there any possibility of error here due to the 2 to 1 turn ratio of crank to cams?
YES, there is a danger. I believe number 1 cylinder is to be at the top of the block. This is a guess. Please verify my words. But YES, most definitely a danger.
 

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The resistance was probably from the valves touching the tops of the pistons. But you did the right thing by working them until they rotated freely.

As long as the marks are lined up like it shows in the service manual it is in time. Number one cylinder will be on TDC if the crankshaft timing marks are aligned. If the two cam gear marks are aligned with the respective marks then the two camshafts are aligned for TDC #1 compression stroke too. If you don’t have a service manual I can upload the pages showing the mark alignment.
I always double check to make sure everything is still lined up after I tension the belt.
 

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The best $25 you can spend is to buy a repair manual for your specific vehicle. I personally like Chilton but Haynes also makes manuals. It will provide you the correct settings as well as the proper procedures.
 

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The resistance was probably from the valves touching the tops of the pistons. But you did the right thing by working them until they rotated freely.

As long as the marks are lined up like it shows in the service manual it is in time. Number one cylinder will be on TDC if the crankshaft timing marks are aligned. If the two cam gear marks are aligned with the respective marks then the two camshafts are aligned for TDC #1 compression stroke too. If you don’t have a service manual I can upload the pages showing the mark alignment.
I always double check to make sure everything is still lined up after I tension the belt.
If you haven't gone an extra turn on the crank. It's 2 crank turns to 1 cams turn. There is a danger of them being wrong even if marks align.
 

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Here's a direct link to the service, anyway: https://ia601305.us.archive.org/2/items/0608HondaPilotSM/06-08 Honda Pilot SM.pdf

Edit: It's for a 2006-2008. In another thread you said you have a 2004, and I uploaded the Timing Belt section of the 2003 service manual, I just remembered.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
If you haven't gone an extra turn on the crank. It's 2 crank turns to 1 cams turn. There is a danger of them being wrong even if marks align.
So it is possible that I may have turned the crank an extra turn then hand turned and lined the timing marks on the cams to tdc instead of them pointing 180 downward. How could I rule that out? Hope that makes sense. I appreciate all of this.
 

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So it is possible that I may have turned the crank an extra turn then hand turned and lined the timing marks on the cams to tdc instead of them pointing 180 downward. How could I rule that out? Hope that makes sense. I appreciate all of this.
Pull cylinder #1 spark plug, stick a long extension or screwdriver in the hole to determine if the piston is at the top.
 

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All three sets of marks will only line up once in 720 degrees of crankshaft rotation when the belt is installed. The cams turn at half the speed of the crank. That is why the cam pulleys are bigger than the crank pulley. When building an engine from scratch (like assembling it during an overhaul) you align the timing reference marks on the cams and crank before you put the belt or chain on and the engine is in time. That is the procedure that they show in the manual. That is what the marks are for.

The only time that the #1 cylinder will be on TDC is when the crankshaft timing marks are aligned.
 

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All three sets of marks will only line up once in 720 degrees of crankshaft rotation when the belt is installed. The cams turn at half the speed of the crank. That is why the cam pulleys are bigger than the crank pulley. When building an engine from scratch (like assembling it during an overhaul) you align the timing reference marks on the cams and crank before you put the belt or chain on and the engine is in time. That is the procedure that they show in the manual. That is what the marks are for.

The only time that the #1 cylinder will be on TDC is when the crankshaft timing marks are aligned.
Not trying to disagree with the manual. Everything is true if your crank isn't one revolution off because your belt jumped time.
 

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So if #1 is at tdc than I am fine?
Remove spark plug from cylinder #1. Insert a long extension or screwdriver into the cylinder to determine if the piston is TDC (Top Dead Center, at the top) if the cylinder is low in the block, you must rotate the crankshaft 1 revolution to bring #1 To the top.
 

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