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Discussion Starter #1
Sorry for the long post.

So the story starts when my Pilot is parked on the street one afternoon while at a friends house. While I was inside, someone backing out of a drive way hits my Pilot in the front drivers quarter panel. The good thing was that one of my friends was just leaving and saw this all happen. He said that it looked like the guy was ready to drive away until the driver saw my friend staring at him. So, the guy stopped and asked my friend if he knew who the car belonged to. He said yes and told him where he could find my wife (I wasn’t at the party yet). Anyway, he walks in and asks for my wife. She starts jotting down all his information. About 2 minutes later, I pull up. I knew about the accident because my friend had already called me to inform me. When I get there, I inspect the damage. Both my wife and the driver thought the only damage was the front quarter panel. I also noticed that the from wheel had also been damaged (not much, but enough to notice). I made sure he knew of the damage to the wheel.

He asked me if I could get an estimate and he would determine if he would file a claim through his insurance or just pay cash. I went and got 4 estimates ranging from $1100 to $1400. That was just the cost to replace and paint the quarter panel. The wheel was another $200 and the cost of a rental was about another $100. When I called him with this, he decided to file a claim.

That night, I get a call from his insurance and they say they will pay for everything. I was happy to hear that. And, one of the estimate I received was from one of their preferred body shops. So, besides the shop warranting the work, the insurance company will also warranty it. So, I decided to take the car there to get it fixed. The car is there for 3 days and I’m driving a Neon as a rental. The bad part of this was that I hurt my back (totally unrelated) again and had a hard time walking and bending over. So, imagine trying to get into a neon with a REALLY bad back (anyone who has a herniated disc should know the discomfort).

On Wednesday, I go to pick up the Pilot. It was raining that day, so I didn’t really get a chance to look over the repair. On Thursday, when the car and the weather were dry, I inspected the work. It looks good from afar, but upon closer inspection, you can see there were spots that didn’t look good. Hard to explain, but it wasn’t a “factory” finish. That same day, I am going through a drive through and when I get to the intercom, I press the express window down, nothing happens. So, I hit it again, still nothing. The window opens fine, but the express window function does not work. I call the body shop and let them know. They ask me to come in the next day and they will check to see if they missed a connection.

On Friday, I take it in and they look it over. Couldn’t find anything wrong. The guy calls Honda and asks about it. The Honda service guy says that he’s had a few Pilots that have had this problem and that I should bring it in and they will probably repair it under warranty. The body shop guy says if they don’t cover it under warranty, he would pay (damn right he’ll pay). So, now the paint imperfections. Some of the things they were able to buff out and it looked fine. But there were 2 spots where it looks like a dust particle got under the paint and clear coat. You can see them if you are looking. The only reason I probably found it was because I was closely examining the body panel they replaced. If someone were to look over the entire car not knowing that I had a new panel installed, they probably wouldn’t find it. I don’t know what I am going to do about this. I may just leave it alone and not have the body shop fix it because like I said, unless you were looking for it, the average person may not find it. What would you guys do?

So, now it’s Friday night and I call Honda to make an appointment for my first oil change (free when I bought the car) and to have the window fixed. The earliest they could get me in is Tuesday. I make the appointment and bring the car in. When I bring the car in, the service rep asks if anything had been done, like disconnecting the battery, removing the door panel. I then had to tell them I don’t know because the car was at the body shop to fix the front quarter panel. They had to do something with the front door since they had to sand and paint it to make it blend with the new panel. So, she then goes on say that there will be a $92 charge just to look at it since there was work done and it wasn’t just a manufacturer’s defect. Wow, I couldn’t believe it was going to be $92. So, I called the body shop to make sure they would pay. After a lengthy discussion with the service rep, he agreed to pay. Then the service rep also goes on and says that there was a door ding on my drivers door (I guess when you bring your car in, there is a dentwizard guy there trying to drum up business). I couldn’t believe it. I asked where and she showed me. It was a very small door ding on the drivers door just above the moulding. Both the service rep and I had to look from various angles to see it (like I said, it was very, very small and almost un-noticable, read carefully, this is foreshadowing). Anyway, I tell her I don’t want it repaired because it was so small and that both of us had a hard time finding it.

Now 12:00 comes around, I go out to lunch and then go to pick up my car. It’s done and I find out they only charged $46 for the window repair. I guess when they disconnected the window module and probably the battery, the express down had to be reset and only Honda can do this. I was a little upset about it and tried to get the money back for the body shop. It doesn’t seem right that if you disconnect the battery, that the express window doesn’t work. What happens if your battery goes dead and you replace it? Do you have to go to Honda and pay them $46 to reprogram the feature. Anyway, I didn’t argue too much because I didn’t have to pay for it. Now as I am leaving, I notice something on the driver’s side door. On the plastic body colored moulding, I see that there is a chunk maybe about an 1/8 of an inch wide missing. I storm back into the dealer ship and ask to talk to the service rep I dealt with since she knows that wasn’t there when I dropped it off. Remember, I mentioned that we had a hard time seeing the door ding. Well, you can’t miss this new ding. I was furious. I can’t believe they would do this and not mention it. They probably thought they could get away with it and say it was there when I brought it in. Good thing the dent wizard was there and found the little door ding. Because of that, the service rep knew that the new ding was not there when I brought it in.

I discuss this with the service manager and the service rep I worked with and she agreed with me that the damage was not there when I brought it in. So, the service manager says they will fix it, and they will fix the original door ding. He mentioned they were going to sand and paint the moulding, but I don’t know how it will look. The ding was pretty deep, like I said, a chunk was missing. We’ll have to wait and see. He said that both repairs would be done by 5:00 today. It’s 3:30 and no word yet.

Because one guy was careless and didn’t look when he was backing out of a drive way, I have to go through all this hassle. Because of this, I called his insurance company and told them I want to file a diminished value claim. The car was still pretty brand new with less than 5000 miles. A professional probably could tell there was body work done and the appraisal would be less then what it would have been had the car not been in an accident. If the insurance company does not give me any money for diminished value, I think I may have them repaint the car again to get the dust particles out. Anyone ever file a diminished value claim?

Sorry for the long post.
 

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well $hit happens....glad it was a minor accedent and the other person's insuraance paid for it.


I think the diminished value is a option on the insurance policy. If he did not carry it you will not get it.

Also you can reset the window yourself. Look in the owners maual on how to do it. I think you hold the switch up and then start the car and it it up for 10 seconds....

Best of luck
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Wow, if it's that simple to fix the window, i can't believe they charged the body shop $46 for it.

The latest update. They were able to fix the ding on the metal. The new ding, apparantly, a gust of wind kicked up when they were painting it and got dust all over it. They say they can't fix it now because the weather is too hot. So, I have to pick it up and bring it back tomorrow so they can try it again.

Again, what a pain in the butt this whole thing has been.
 

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Paint and Body Repair Info (from experience)

First off, the dusty "look" in the new paint, may just be a "clearcoat" finishing that the body shop can take out. I had two swirly looking "dusty" circles in the fender I had to have redone on my Sagebrush PILOT, and I took it back to the paint shop, they explained to me what it was - and whammo - 5-minutes later it was gone.

As for the window problem, if you had read your owner's manual, you could have saved yourself 46-bucks.

Word of advice, if you have a problem with your PILOT - check this site out or read your owner's manual - there's a wealth of knowledge with both sources.


PILOTinginCO
Sagebrush Pearl-EX
 

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wsong said:
Sorry for the long post.
[snip]
On Wednesday, I go to pick up the Pilot. It was raining that day, so I didn’t really get a chance to look over the repair. On Thursday, when the car and the weather were dry, I inspected the work. It looks good from afar, but upon closer inspection, you can see there were spots that didn’t look good. Hard to explain, but it wasn’t a “factory” finish.
[snip]
So, now the paint imperfections. Some of the things they were able to buff out and it looked fine. But there were 2 spots where it looks like a dust particle got under the paint and clear coat. You can see them if you are looking. The only reason I probably found it was because I was closely examining the body panel they replaced. If someone were to look over the entire car not knowing that I had a new panel installed, they probably wouldn’t find it. I don’t know what I am going to do about this. I may just leave it alone and not have the body shop fix it because like I said, unless you were looking for it, the average person may not find it. What would you guys do?
First off, I'm so sorry to hear about your bad fortunes with the Pilot. I've never filed a diminished value claim, but you definitely should. Because of your bad back, perhaps you're not willing to go through another repair, but I would look into getting another paint job, at least. But, certainly, with a car less than 5,000miles, there's no way you should settle for a repair job that makes your car look less than new. The panel that was repaired should look as good as the same area on the opposite side.

Document everything, from visits to the dealer, the repair shop, the content of the discussions that took place and take photos if you can. Make sure to point out the spots on the repaired area to the bodyshop that did the work and tell them you want it fixed. There's no way that you should have to settle for anything less. And also mention the less than satisfying work to the insurance company and find out what can be done about it. They're also warrantying the work, right?

I don't think it's unreasonable to expect and receive a paint job that is blemish free, again, especially on a new car. If you can actually see some particles/dust in the paint, then that means they didn't do the paint job properly. I had the same problem with my paint job and I know what you're talking about. There's no way you should see something like that. They might argue that, "Well, if you look close enough, you'll find something wrong with just about anything." or, "You're never gonna get a paint job looking as good as the factory one.", but don't let them get away with that. Tell the insurance company that you have every right to expect and receive a repair/paint job to make your car look every bit as good as another Pilot that has less than 5Kmiles on it. Tell them that if your car was 2 years or older, you wouldn't be so adamant about it, but this is a car that's way less than a year old and not even 5Kmiles on it.
So, now it’s Friday night and I call Honda to make an appointment...
[snip]
Now 12:00 comes around, I go out to lunch and then go to pick up my car. It’s done and I find out they only charged $46 for the window repair. I guess when they disconnected the window module and probably the battery, the express down had to be reset and only Honda can do this. I was a little upset about it and tried to get the money back for the body shop. It doesn’t seem right that if you disconnect the battery, that the express window doesn’t work. What happens if your battery goes dead and you replace it? Do you have to go to Honda and pay them $46 to reprogram the feature.
About this auto up/down feature repair by the dealer, do you know if it required anything more than just resetting it, as per the manual? Take a look at http://www.geocities.com/ba_kwon/pilotmanual/p059.htm and click on Page 101. There, you can read about resetting the auto up/down window feature, usually performed after the battery was disconnected. Ask your dealer if this was all which was done to your Pilot or if something more was required to fix the problem. If they only had to do exactly what the manual instructed and they charged you for that, either, a) complain vehemently to the service manager about the exorbitant amount of the charge, or b) at least let them know, even if implicitly, what they did was wrong, since it's not you who's stuck with the bill.
Anyway, I didn’t argue too much because I didn’t have to pay for it. Now as I am leaving, I notice something on the driver’s side door. On the plastic body colored moulding, I see that there is a chunk maybe about an 1/8 of an inch wide missing.
[snip]
So, the service manager says they will fix it, and they will fix the original door ding. He mentioned they were going to sand and paint the moulding, but I don’t know how it will look. The ding was pretty deep, like I said, a chunk was missing. We’ll have to wait and see. He said that both repairs would be done by 5:00 today. It’s 3:30 and no word yet.
If you can't notice the damage/gap that was there, IOW, it's as good as new, then I guess you'd have nothing to complain about. But, if you still notice the gap because it was too deep or wide, then ask for a new door moulding to be installed. It's hard to guess whether the person who inflicted the damage on the moulding knew about it and decided not to disclose it or was completely oblivious to it. What matters is that it gets repaired, like new.
Because one guy was careless and didn’t look when he was backing out of a drive way, I have to go through all this hassle. Because of this, I called his insurance company and told them I want to file a diminished value claim. The car was still pretty brand new with less than 5000 miles. A professional probably could tell there was body work done and the appraisal would be less then what it would have been had the car not been in an accident. If the insurance company does not give me any money for diminished value, I think I may have them repaint the car again to get the dust particles out. Anyone ever file a diminished value claim?

Sorry for the long post.
Like ramirami said, crap happens, it's all part of life. But, if more and more crap gets piled onto the first pile, then it's time to take action and throw the idea of "being the nice guy" out the window.

Why do you have to take any more crap, telling yourself it's all part of life, when you had absolutely nothing to do with it, ESPECIALLY, when there's a detrimental affect on the value of your property?

Good luck with this, I mean it. I went through something similar and it was not fun at all. Oh, another thing, unless you have a really good reason to do so, I'd avoid that dealer you were using. From what I just read, they don't seem that trustworthy at all.
 

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If you are not happy with the body work or paint job, take it back and have them redo it. About a year ago, my wife accidentally dented the passenger door on our black 2001 Acura TL turning into the garage. Damage was over $1000. When we got the car back, paint matched perfectly. You could not tell that the car was in an accident. So, it is possible to get your Pilot back to factory conditions. If you don't get satisfaction, file a complaint. All body shops are licensed. Don't settle for less.
 

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Dimished Value Experience: Lesson Learned

I'm a new member and just joined last night. My wife has been driving a Honda for the last 6-7 years, CRVs and now a Pilot.

My wife had a brand new '02 CRV EX, less than 5 months old and only 6,000 miles. It had $5,900 damage done to it in a 5-car pile up where she was the first hit by a Crown Vic that slammed her into a mini van and then 2 more ahead of that. She had the most damage of anything in the line since she was the worst rearended and the second worst frontended.

The insurance company admitted that their guy caused the whole thing and since she was stopped before the initial impact, he took the hit for all five vehicles.

Now, we got the offer for the initial $5,900 when I started complaining that the car was completely not worth what it was before the accident. I did some research and found that generally, dimished value claims must have significant damage (less than totaled) and the vehicle's value should be relatively high compared to original price and the diminished value amount falls off fairly rapidly like depreciation.

We ended up getting roughly $2,200 additional for the dimished portion of our vehicle claim. It is generally 25% of the damage or 10-15% of the vehicles pre-damaged value, depending on age and mileage. You will have to fight for it if you get it at all. It took us 6 weeks to get a fair figure. We ended up trading it unrepaired for the Pilot my wife drives now.

You can try to get dimished value but for $1,400 in damages, I'd be surprised if you get much. Your dimished value is only going to be about $350 based on the damage estimate and they aren't going to pay you 10% for that little damage.

Google for it and you'll find very little out there. It is not law in many places and it is somewhat discretionary by insurance company/adjuster.

I wish you luck and hope you get something but this is non-structural and mostly PITA stuff, not safety/structural.
 

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wsong said:
Wow, if it's that simple to fix the window, i can't believe they charged the body shop $46 for it.

QUOTE]
Like RipRock said. The same thing happened with my car when Honda had to repaint the entire hood due to a factory defect on the paint. I got the car back from the body-shop and the up/down feature wasn't working. I posted the question here and someone told me the fix was inside the owner's manual.
The next time I took my car in for the water pump/timing belt recall, they replaced the battery and I got the car back with the same problem. But this time I was able to do the programing myself.

As far as the paint job goes, this body-shop did a better job then the factory paint.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Next time I have a problem, I'll have to remember to look here first.

The latest update. I dropped the car off at the dealer again Thursday morning to fix the side moulding again. I get a call before lunch time that it is complete. I go to pick it up and before I go the the desk, I look over the car to see how it looks. Again, they didn't do a good job. all the dirt that blew onto it the first time is gone. But now, there is a hair like item under the paint. you can see it from a couple of feet away, but not any farther, you probably can't see it unless you know where to look. At this point, i decided that I was just going to take it because who knows what would happen next. So, I go into the service area and pick up my key. As I was walking out, the service rep saw me and asked me how everything looked. I just replied it's "ok", but that I don't want to deal with it. He asked me if it wwasn't perfect. I said no. He wanted to see it so we walked outside to look at it. He was in agreement that it wasn't as good as it should have been. He asked what he could do and I just said I didn't want to do it again because who knows what will happen next time. another ding, the paint job won't look good. Then he mentioned he could order a new colored side moulding and put it on. At that point, i said i would take that. So I am bringing the car in Tuesday to have it installed.

Then he goes on to mention the survey that I should be receiving. That's when it clicked in my head that he knew I wouldn't give a good survey and that is why he offered to give me the new moulding. I told him I won't fill out the survey till after they install the new moulding. We'll see how it goes.

How would you guys fill out the survey? It could be bad just because of all I had to go through. Or, It could be good because they took care of everything.

Finally, i haven't heard back from the insurance company about the diminished value yet. But i think I am going to have them repaint it. Every time i look at those dust particles, it looks bigger every time. And now, I found another one. That's three all together so far. I'm going to have to wash it and look even more carefully to see if there are any others.
 

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You are owed a fully repaired to your satisfaction vehicle, assuming you have realistic expectations. There is no reason to settle for a shoddy job. If the shop can't keep a dust-free paint booth, I'd never have them do anything after they get this fixed. If the insurance company backed them, I'd tell them you want another shop to do the repair that will provide a like-quality finish comparable to the original factory finish. That is not too much to ask.

A paint booth should be the equivalent of a hospital operating room from a dirt/dust point of view. There is no reason for the kind of experience you are having if they have any type of quality control.

I've done a little paint work for myself here and there. If they just did a panel, they probably did a quickie job and didn't even put it in the booth.

As for the dealer's survey, would you deal with them again? If not, burn them as you see fit. If they are making an effort, the quality of their repairs is somewhat based on their people. As long as they make it right without a fuss, I'd scratch their back while they're scratching yours.

Good luck
 
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