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I am out of ideas, 2006 Pilot EX-L 207K. Bought it with random misfire cyl 1,2,3,4,5,6 and noticeable exhaust put, put. However it had excellent highway acceleration, great in town driveability and acceleration, etc. Idle was relatively smooth, the random misses apparently evened out the vibration along with fluid dampening mounts. Drove 75 miles home to discover it got 10.6 mgp. Mechanic checked all cyl compression and advised new plugs. He cleared code, drove it without code return. I got it drove it less than a day & back to random misfire all cylinders. Mechanic suggested new coil packs. Replaced all .... slight change to random misfire cyl 1,3, 4, 5, 6. Asked mechanic to recheck codes, he said there was an EGR code first then the misfire code. I replace EGR and related valve. MOST SIGNIFICANT CHANGE ..... no more random misfire, instead steady misfire cyl P0306, 3, 1 & P0300. Mechanic recommended recheck compression .... all cyl 180 - 195. I also did a leakdown test. All cylinders 100 psi input pressure gauge with steady 100 psi on leak gauge. I got to wondering what role the Variable drive solenoid plays. Found out it adjusts cyl valve timing ..... OK so I am almost about to pull the VVT Solenoid to check the screen for clogging. Also forgot ran 3 cans one at at time of Seafoam, which compression and leak-down confirmed no valve leakage.

Help I need some guidance. The 3 mechanics I have talked to want to repeat the compression and leak-down tests again ..... I seriously rented and kept the gauges for over a month, I check compression hot, cold, with tbsp oil in each cyl, did leak-down 3 times each cyl ..... ONLY leak I got was the flimsy o-ring not seating on sparkplug port and a faint blow-by in EACH cylinder into crankcase ..... I understand that is normal rings are not 100% seal and by then the engine had cooled anyway.

Help!! Great vehicle, but 9 to 10 mpg is not ok and bad for engine, catalytic converter and will produce another EGR failure.
 

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Before going any further, how about checking off a couple of easy and inexpensive things to try from your list?

  1. Try replacing the PCV valve with one from Rockauto or somewhere. For about 20 bucks, it's certainly worth a shot in your case. It literally is 5 minutes with one easily accessible bolt. Whether you do it yourself or have a mechanic do it, however, heed the cautionary tale in this link: Broken PCV Valve Stuck in Engine FIX

  2. Meticulously check if there is a crack in the air intake tube that gets bent when the air filter gets changed, as you can see in this video. Feel for cracks on the underside of the tube as well, especially near the hose clamps .

    https://d2n97g4vasjwsk.cloudfront.net/2006 Honda Pilot EX 3.5L V6/Air Filter Engine - Part 1 - 480p.mp4

    In fact, I make it part of my air filter replacement routine to check for cracks all along that tube each time I finish putting in a new air filter.
 

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I would clean the mass airflow sensor with CRC Electronic Cleaner, let dry thoroughly and reinstall.
VVT solenoid and/or screen is a very common malfunction at the milage your at, but is usually accompanied with oil consumption or loss along with bad fuel economy.
 
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Going thru similar misfires but have random misfires in addition- Need Valves Adjusted AFTER TIMING BELT/CAMS & CRANK are correctly aligned again. Either missed during Timing Belt replacement last October or something?? This is what was diagnosed by new Trusted Mechanic yesterday and I will be looking myself after I understand how marks are layed out on harmonic balancer (drive belt pulley)
 

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Going thru similar misfires but have random misfires in addition- Need Valves Adjusted AFTER TIMING BELT/CAMS & CRANK are correctly aligned again. Either missed during Timing Belt replacement last October or something?? This is what was diagnosed by new Trusted Mechanic yesterday and I will be looking myself after I understand how marks are layed out on harmonic balancer (drive belt pulley)
That sounds plausable. You could be one tooth off on the timing belt on the back cam. Let us know what is found out. Thanks for the update.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Before going any further, how about checking off a couple of easy and inexpensive things to try from your list?

  1. Try replacing the PCV valve with one from Rockauto or somewhere. For about 20 bucks, it's certainly worth a shot in your case. It literally is 5 minutes with one easily accessible bolt. Whether you do it yourself or have a mechanic do it, however, heed the cautionary tale in this link: Broken PCV Valve Stuck in Engine FIX

  2. Meticulously check if there is a crack in the air intake tube that gets bent when the air filter gets changed, as you can see in this video. Feel for cracks on the underside of the tube as well, especially near the hose clamps .

    https://d2n97g4vasjwsk.cloudfront.net/2006 Honda Pilot EX 3.5L V6/Air Filter Engine - Part 1 - 480p.mp4

    In fact, I make it part of my air filter replacement routine to check for cracks all along that tube each time I finish putting in a new air filter.
Thank you for feedback! All good! I am pretty sure there are not intake leaks. The intake gasket was replaced when I had injectors rebuilt (injectors were rusted into the rail and had aluminum corrosion built up in injector seats - real learning experience - likely original injectors) after gasket replace and intake reassemble I redid the smoke test to reassure myself I had sealed intake manifold ..... no leaks anywhere until I removed a vacuum line & got a nice stream of smoke out fitting ..... I will recheck intake leaks again though and make sure I unplug the manifold throttle motor and open the throttle plate. It may have been sealed and no smoke got thru to air intake hose after MAP and filter canister. About the PCV valve ...... I think when I got the EGR code I got focused on that system. I replace EGR and purge solenoid valve, I checked the evap canister bypass, two way valve & shut valve. I think I was under the impression or read that Honda had eliminated the PCV valve. I see PCV now. Will replace it. BTW where is the MAP/MAF in the 2006 Honda Pilot EX-L. I could not get a location on a MAP/MAF sensor.
I would clean the mass airflow sensor with CRC Electronic Cleaner, let dry thoroughly and reinstall.
VVT solenoid and/or screen is a very common malfunction at the milage your at, but is usually accompanied with oil consumption or loss along with bad fuel economy.
If someone can point me to MAP/MAF, will clean - already have MAF cleaner.

Actually, at 9.98 mpg I am thinking I do have a gas efficieny issue - infact I would have not done a darn thing if I hadn't gotten 10 mpg on the drive from car lot. VVT solenoid is looking like a remove, check for gasket leak and / or clean screen or .... replace. Make sure solenoid plunger moves. Correct?

After all that if I am still stuck with P0306, 03, 01 and P0300, I am out of bullets!

Thanks gents!
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I had the same problem and a valve adjustment fixed everything related to the cylinder misfires.


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OK, well just now saw your post. Well not out of bullets! I will make an appointment with mechanic, if the after the PCV, MAP clean and VVT clean I still have 10 mpg & code 306, 03, 01, 300
 

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Thank you for feedback! All good! I am pretty sure there are not intake leaks. The intake gasket was replaced when I had injectors rebuilt (injectors were rusted into the rail and had aluminum corrosion built up in injector seats - real learning experience - likely original injectors) after gasket replace and intake reassemble I redid the smoke test to reassure myself I had sealed intake manifold ..... no leaks anywhere until I removed a vacuum line & got a nice stream of smoke out fitting ..... I will recheck intake leaks again though and make sure I unplug the manifold throttle motor and open the throttle plate. It may have been sealed and no smoke got thru to air intake hose after MAP and filter canister. About the PCV valve ...... I think when I got the EGR code I got focused on that system. I replace EGR and purge solenoid valve, I checked the evap canister bypass, two way valve & shut valve. I think I was under the impression or read that Honda had eliminated the PCV valve. I see PCV now. Will replace it. BTW where is the MAP/MAF in the 2006 Honda Pilot EX-L. I could not get a location on a MAP/MAF sensor.


If someone can point me to MAP/MAF, will clean - already have MAF cleaner.

Actually, at 9.98 mpg I am thinking I do have a gas efficieny issue - infact I would have not done a darn thing if I hadn't gotten 10 mpg on the drive from car lot. VVT solenoid is looking like a remove, check for gasket leak and / or clean screen or .... replace. Make sure solenoid plunger moves. Correct?

After all that if I am still stuck with P0306, 03, 01 and P0300, I am out of bullets!

Thanks gents!
 

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Valve adjustment was suppose to be done at 105K. You are at 207K. If you haven’t done that you are way over due and you probably have some tight valves causing the misfires. You could do it yourself it’s not really hard to do. Just time consuming.

I didn’t see you saw my post till after I posted this.

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Valve adjustment was suppose to be done at 105K. You are at 207K. If you haven’t done that you are way over due and you probably have some tight valves causing the misfires. You could do it yourself it’s not really hard to do. Just time consuming.

I didn’t see you saw my post till after I posted this.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Well this has been a totally new adventure in auto mechanic steep learning curve. I have driven pre-2000 vehicles for the past 40 years. Everything is basically mechanical and anything that got "bigger than my toolbox" I handed off. My first vehicle adventure was as a frustrated 15 yr old driving my dads old '57 Olds 88 to school. It overheated and was embarrassing to pull into the parking lot with steam rolling out. So.... after hearing what mechanics told my dad about cracked heads and other end-of-the-world scenarios to a kid who only had a set of craftsman box / open end wrenches, I decided to take the advice of an older gentleman at our local parts store ..... check the water pump. I pulled the wp off (wow there was so much room under those hoods) and this black flat round thing with fins fell off the shaft. Come to find out GM engineers decided to "CUT COSTS" (we've all heard that one before) and make the impeller out of phenolic (old bakelite high temp plastic). Replaced water pump with a steel impeller and the rest is history. The car ended up 1500 miles away in Illinois with my sister 10 years later. This Pilot seems to be like that old Olds 88. The under hood is huge, it is laid out easy to get to and it seemed the misfire was going to be straightforward, within my wheelhouse. Needless to say, my wheelhouse has grown exponentially.

OK, seriously if I have gotten this far ..... well give me some youtube video links on adjusting valves on a 2006 Honda Pilot and ... I'm on it! Let me know ..... at this point I'm game - let the fun begin! :cool:
 

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Here are a few for a 2005 PIlot. Hope it's close enough to add to your wheelhouse. :)

Might want to listen to the second one on mute. ?




And here's our glib and helpful friend, ErictheCarGuy, parts 1 and 2.




As your high school English teacher said, "Compare and contrast." :)

Hey, how about making a video yourself as you go ahead and take this on?
 

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Well this has been a totally new adventure in auto mechanic steep learning curve. I have driven pre-2000 vehicles for the past 40 years. Everything is basically mechanical and anything that got "bigger than my toolbox" I handed off. My first vehicle adventure was as a frustrated 15 yr old driving my dads old '57 Olds 88 to school. It overheated and was embarrassing to pull into the parking lot with steam rolling out. So.... after hearing what mechanics told my dad about cracked heads and other end-of-the-world scenarios to a kid who only had a set of craftsman box / open end wrenches, I decided to take the advice of an older gentleman at our local parts store ..... check the water pump. I pulled the wp off (wow there was so much room under those hoods) and this black flat round thing with fins fell off the shaft. Come to find out GM engineers decided to "CUT COSTS" (we've all heard that one before) and make the impeller out of phenolic (old bakelite high temp plastic). Replaced water pump with a steel impeller and the rest is history. The car ended up 1500 miles away in Illinois with my sister 10 years later. This Pilot seems to be like that old Olds 88. The under hood is huge, it is laid out easy to get to and it seemed the misfire was going to be straightforward, within my wheelhouse. Needless to say, my wheelhouse has grown exponentially.

OK, seriously if I have gotten this far ..... well give me some youtube video links on adjusting valves on a 2006 Honda Pilot and ... I'm on it! Let me know ..... at this point I'm game - let the fun begin! :cool:
My Pilot was a 2003 with 250K at the time I had all the misfire codes. I did everything you did and was about to give up and donate the car too cause it wasn’t going to pass smog. Then I read that the valves needed adjustment and I thought hey I have nothing to lose if I mess it up since I was going to donate it anyway. So I used this opportunity to learn how to do valve adjustments. I watched a bunch of you tube videos and got at it. Plplplpl just posted a bunch of videos. If I could do it I’m pretty sure you could do it!


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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Here are a few for a 2005 PIlot. Hope it's close enough to add to your wheelhouse. :)

Might want to listen to the second one on mute. ?




And here's our glib and helpful friend, ErictheCarGuy, parts 1 and 2.




As your high school English teacher said, "Compare and contrast." :)

Hey, how about making a video yourself as you go ahead and take this on?
I appreciate the complement .... regarding the value of a video .... I got the Pilot in mid-Dec '19 .... it is April. It has taken me 4 months of finding out the hard way how to do all the stuff I listed. I learn by making mistakes, fortunately not really bad ones but still time eaters none the less. I have had all my tools in the rear of the Pilot since January. My wife has had to negotiate when I can reassemble it so she can drive it on errends. Truly a work in progress. The thread starter summary left out issues like, having to get two compression loaners due to the first one being so beat up and I finally figured out after doing the compression check a number of times (actually who was counting at that point) that the hose was leaking at the crimp to the valve stem threaded fitting. That is why you get 90 psi one time and 120 the next. So I finally got consistent compression readings above 180 with the new loaner and ... feeling success was mine! .... I took out the valve stem to do the leak-down test (which I credit oldskool funk for the idea to build). Leak down went fine with newer loaner except for the supplied skinny little O-ring leaked at spark plug port seat. I replaced it with a thicker compressible one. Extra compression thickness sealed all but cyl #2 .... of course on back firewall side of engine, so I cranked it down till no more leak at plug port interface .... alright!!! good compression #'s, perfect leak-down #'s all cylinders .... I don't have to learn how to take the heads off for a valve job!!!! Ooooops, crap, seriously, the new compression hose begins to turn at the crimp, it WILL NOT loosen! I let it cool overnight, spray plug well with a shot of PB blaster (which probably swelled the O-ring - duh) .... nope still no budge. Nope two small shank long screwdrivers with a hose clamp around the hose / screwdriver combo will not move it either .... OK, what to do now. Time create a tool like my dad had for removing deep set spark plugs before there were deep socket wrenches. It was a thin steel long cylinder with the plug hex on one end and a hole / pin-bar thru the round cylinder on the other. So got a piece of 0.020" steel, cut it to length of well + ~ 1.5" longer than plug well. Cut 5 slits at the hex widths of a 19 mm nut, then folded in a vise to make a hex shaped tube. Only issue was the tines were too wide with just one band saw pass to fit between the 6 knurles of the hose plug fitting, so I trimmed the tines another 40 thous each .... manuevered it down around the hexhead on the hose plug fitting and put the 19mm on the top solid hex shaped end and loosened & turned it out first quarter.

I appreciate the nod to do the video. I will watch the how to video's and do a writeup after I'm finished with perhaps some photos to show the steps.

All the best,
Perry
 

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Good luck on the valve adjust. That is not a job for the faint of heart. Getting feeler gauges in the rear bank exhaust valves is quite the task. I recommend a set of long feeler gauges with a bend in the end of them. That's what I use.

You're right at the mileage where misfires can often occur if the valves have never been adjusted. Here is a great video on how to diagnose it

 

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The worst time with our 05 was all exhaust related. First the EGR valve failed. Easy fix once the dang bolts came loose. You've done that. The Cats started to cry enough a short time later with the P420.. cleared that a couple of times but they were strangling the engine, ...All about the same miles as you have....Cats replaced
You don't have that code but I'm wondering and just trying to convince myself that you are developing cat issue that just hasn't coded. Ours ran poorly for some time before it coded but lacked the misfire codes that you have.
Not sure it matters but is yours FWD or AWD?
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Thanks! Mine has only the MAP on the throttle body.
Found, PB blaster loosened encrusted oxidation, got out, sprayed inside with CRC MAP sensor multiple x's, appeared clean no residue, no change in code 306,03, 01, P0300, P0741 or engine mis

is there a step or part of the process I missed? I recall when I replaced the EGR and purge valve I got instant change.

So far only two part change outs gave change in performance / codes --- changing plugs 1st part change & EGR / purge ---- rest were nibble around the edges

Appreciated the feedback - any other ideas would be helpful

- had an interruption in follow thru on suggestions .... my "garage" got rained out for a week (street parking only) and my youngest's COVID compliant wedding. They remarked that even a very small wedding was a lot of work! Live stream is pretty cool technology. They actually had many friends who could live stream on their phones. Amazing world we live in!
 

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Found, PB blaster loosened encrusted oxidation, got out, sprayed inside with CRC MAP sensor multiple x's, appeared clean no residue, no change in code 306,03, 01, P0300, P0741 or engine mis

is there a step or part of the process I missed? I recall when I replaced the EGR and purge valve I got instant change.

So far only two part change outs gave change in performance / codes --- changing plugs 1st part change & EGR / purge ---- rest were nibble around the edges

Appreciated the feedback - any other ideas would be helpful

- had an interruption in follow thru on suggestions .... my "garage" got rained out for a week (street parking only) and my youngest's COVID compliant wedding. They remarked that even a very small wedding was a lot of work! Live stream is pretty cool technology. They actually had many friends who could live stream on their phones. Amazing world we live in!
Yes, you missed the part where you actually diagnose instead of just throwing parts and "maybe this'll work" things at it that have little to do with your problem. I would find a different mechanic than the one that wanted to throw all new coil packs on it. Plugs I can see, but not coil packs. As a side note, I'd be concerned about the brand used. Some are cheap junk, even when compared to a set of OEM's that are original.

Second, cleaning MAP sensors is not a good idea. The MAP doesn't work like a MAF. On a MAF you are cleaning a hot wire resistor. On a MAP it's just a pressure sensor and you can do more harm than good spraying cleaner into a sensitive pressure sensor.

Third, you need a scan tool that can look at some live data. It takes 5 seconds to look at a MAP sensor, see that the voltage is under 1v at idle, and rule it out (you could even do this with a volt meter right at the sensor if you don't have the scan tool.) You can then look at fuel trims and see if you're running rich or lean. You can look at O2 sensor data and see what they're doing and how they're reporting. In 10 minutes you've ruled out several things.

Right now, you're wasting your time, hoping you get lucky. If the valves have never been adjusted that needs to be done first along with a quick glance at timing marks to make sure it's not off. You have to do this to adjust the valves anyway. I know adjusting the valves is a big job and a little costly, but at your vehicle mileage it needs to be done.
 

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Found, PB blaster loosened encrusted oxidation, got out, sprayed inside with CRC MAP sensor multiple x's, appeared clean no residue, no change in code 306,03, 01, P0300, P0741 or engine mis

is there a step or part of the process I missed? I recall when I replaced the EGR and purge valve I got instant change.

So far only two part change outs gave change in performance / codes --- changing plugs 1st part change & EGR / purge ---- rest were nibble around the edges

Appreciated the feedback - any other ideas would be helpful

- had an interruption in follow thru on suggestions .... my "garage" got rained out for a week (street parking only) and my youngest's COVID compliant wedding. They remarked that even a very small wedding was a lot of work! Live stream is pretty cool technology. They actually had many friends who could live stream on their phones. Amazing world we live in
Yes, you missed the part where you actually diagnose instead of just throwing parts and "maybe this'll work" things at it that have little to do with your problem. I would find a different mechanic than the one that wanted to throw all new coil packs on it. Plugs I can see, but not coil packs. As a side note, I'd be concerned about the brand used. Some are cheap junk, even when compared to a set of OEM's that are original.

Second, cleaning MAP sensors is not a good idea. The MAP doesn't work like a MAF. On a MAF you are cleaning a hot wire resistor. On a MAP it's just a pressure sensor and you can do more harm than good spraying cleaner into a sensitive pressure sensor.

Third, you need a scan tool that can look at some live data. It takes 5 seconds to look at a MAP sensor, see that the voltage is under 1v at idle, and rule it out (you could even do this with a volt meter right at the sensor if you don't have the scan tool.) You can then look at fuel trims and see if you're running rich or lean. You can look at O2 sensor data and see what they're doing and how they're reporting. In 10 minutes you've ruled out several things.

Right now, you're wasting your time, hoping you get lucky. If the valves have never been adjusted that needs to be done first along with a quick glance at timing marks to make sure it's not off. You have to do this to adjust the valves anyway. I know adjusting the valves is a big job and a little costly, but at your vehicle mileage it needs to be done.
John_Clark is Right!
I just paid a mechanic 125$ to diagnose my 2005 and he came back with Valves Need Adjusting and Timing off 1- Tooth. Still trying to get local mechanic who did Timing belt job few months ago to come by house and have a peek- It’s on his way to work. I have it on jack stands and bottom drive pulley Aligned with bottom cover Pointer perfectly results in rear cam perfectly for TDC- #1 but Front (Bank 2) Cam is Retarded 1/4” which I believe is a tooth.
Get on those Valves bro! I’m on it but in holding pattern 👎
 
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