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Discussion Starter #1
I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned it yet, but that new Saturn Vue Red Line edition is going to have 250hp version of Honda's 3.5L engine. If that's true, then the Pilot will have 10 LESS horsepower than the smaller Vue :( , and on top of that, there will be VTEC in something other than a Honda!! :3:
 

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FROM THE ABOVE MENTIONED PRESS RELEASE: ..."Its not known at this time whether or not the 3.5L V6's power and torque ratings will differ for Saturn. However, Jill Lajdziak, Saturn vice president-sales, service, and marketing, says that the V6 will be"specifically engineered" for Saturn ."
To me, it looks like the engine is going to be built especially for Saturn. It think that Honda would be smart enough to keep some competitive advantage over the VUE on the HP and VTEC issues if possible
 

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Does that means 2004 pilot is going to be 250 HP ..
 

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Discussion Starter #5
From Motortrend.com:

2004 Saturn Vue Red Line
Saturn is taking a step to generate new interest in the brand by developing a series of performance-tuned vehicles called the Red Line. The series -- which will also include a Red Line Ion quad coupe -- is due to arrive in early 2004 and features a variety of interior and exterior refinements as well as a new 3.5-liter/250-horse V-6 engine that promises to propel the Vue 0-60 mph in about 7 seconds. The Vue Red Line will be available in both front- and all-wheel drive, and boasts a lower ride height and stiffer springs and sport steering calibration as well as aggressive 18-inch aluminum wheels wrapped in P245/50R18 Bridgestone Turanza performance touring tires for improved ride and handling. Appearance add-ons include new rockers, front and rear fascia, chrome exhaust tips, and exclusive badging. Saturn has also announced that it is developing a hybrid-powertrain Vue to debut in 2005.

From Edmunds.com:

More than just a looks package, the VUE Red Line has the hardware to back up its daring body mods. First and foremost is a beefy 3.5-liter V6 with 250 horsepower and 242 pound-feet of twist, putting it head and shoulders above anything else in the compact SUV class. A five-speed automatic shifts the gears and either front- or all-wheel drive can be had. Saturn claims that the Red Line can blast from zero to 60 mph in just 7 seconds, making it quicker than most midsize 'utes packing V8s. A sport suspension, antilock brakes (albeit with drums still out back), "performance tuned" steering and 18-inch alloy wheels with meaty 245/50 Bridgestone Turanzas complete the functional upgrades. Whether these tweaks will be able to vanquish the off-the-line torque steer we've experienced in our long-term VUE remains to be seen.

From thecarconnection.com:

Honda innards

The VUE will be the first Red Line model to hit the road, rolling into dealer showrooms in December. The crossover will feature a lower, performance-tuned suspension, ground effect body panels, 18-inch wheels, and a new 3.5-liter V-6 turning out 250 horsepower.

The engine is being provided by Honda as part of an unusual swap for some of GM’s diesel powerplants. Currently Saturn offers the VUE with either an in-line four or a 3.0-liter V-6. The latter engine will be replaced by the 3.5-liter Honda engine in all Vue V-6 models, not just the Red Line series.


Looks like 250hp to me...:eek: Maybe they are going to supply the Acura RL's 3.5L (non-VTEC I think), only with more power. That way they save VTEC for Honda/Acura only.:12:
 

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Yeah, but...

The Saturn VUE is a piece of plastic junk and with having that strong an engine in it, the body panels will likely be peeled off!!!!

The VUE is suck a hunk of garbage - having a Honda engine in it will only increase its resale value!


PILOTinginCO
Sagebrush Pearl-EX
Parker, CO
 

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Re: Yeah, but...

PILOTinginCO said:
The Saturn VUE is a piece of plastic junk and with having that strong an engine in it, the body panels will likely be peeled off!!!!

The VUE is suck a hunk of garbage - having a Honda engine in it will only increase its resale value!


PILOTinginCO
Sagebrush Pearl-EX
Parker, CO
So, tell us how you realy feel :2: :2:
 

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car and driver

Don't leave out Car and Driver. Personally, I feel this is a right decision for GM. If you can't make the right engine, then buy it from who can. If you can't build the right car, maybe you should just quit making them.




Saturn Hits the Red Line
April 10, 2003

Saturn is jumping into the growing "tuner" or performance market with "Red Line" branded versions of its Ion coupe and VUE sport utility vehicle, the Detroit News reported.

The 2004 Red Line VUE will go into production in early 2004 at Saturn's Spring Hill, Tenn., plant, the News said. It will be powered by a new 3.5 liter, V-6 250 horsepower engine developed and built by Honda Motor Co. The engine will be available on 2004 model year VUEs.
The Red Line Ion will be powered by a 2.0 liter, 4-cylinder supercharged 200 horsepower Ecotec engine and will go into production early next year. It will compete with the Ford Focus SVT and Honda Civic Si.

The company expects to build about 5,000 Red Line Ions and 3,000 Red Line VUEs. Pricing will be announced closer to model launch, the story said.
 

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Remember

Honda is first and formost an engine company.
 

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WARNING: Essay ahead :D

Although I am still a GM fan, I think GM's use of Honda engines in THEIR OWN CARS is a bunch of crap!! Or maybe PATHETIC would be a better term.

I'm not bashing Honda engines, I'm just saying that it shows GM has finally waved the white flag and is now saying "we can't build good engines and we're too lazy to learn how to develop new ones." I mean come on...they are the biggest car company in the world, that is soon going to be getting engines from ANOTHER large automaker to put in probably half their own cars. If I worked at GM, I would be shaking my head right now, not to mention extremely embarrassed.

If they are going to bring Honda engines into their cars, why not have Honda build their cars for them?? Then they would really gain back market share!

I know that probably the major advantage of doing this engine swap is to help increase their fuel economy standards, and the use of VTEC's in the GM vehicles will be a huge plus, but it just shows that GM has basically given up.

What a sad day for GM fans.:headshak:
 

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GreenMachine said:
Looks like 250hp to me...:eek: Maybe they are going to supply the Acura RL's 3.5L (non-VTEC I think), only with more power. That way they save VTEC for Honda/Acura only.:12: [/B]
The RL engine is longitudinal mount (RL is still named Legend out of the US), and
it is made in Japan.

The TL/MDX/Pilot 3.5L is based on the 3.0 L Accord engine (transverse mount) and
it is made in the US.

Tat
 

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Discussion Starter #13
tatng said:


The RL engine is longitudinal mount (RL is still named Legend out of the US), and
it is made in Japan.

The TL/MDX/Pilot 3.5L is based on the 3.0 L Accord engine (transverse mount) and
it is made in the US.

Tat
Hmm... did not know that.. I just figured that since the RL is front wheel drive, it had a transverse mounted engine as well. I was just hoping that the Saturn's engine would not have VTEC... I just don't want to see a bunch a Vue's running about with big VTEC or Type R stickers..:twak:

BTW, I agree Pilot-1, now GM will finally have a reliable engine with low emissions, thanks to Honda.;)
 

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GreenMachine said:


Hmm... did not know that.. I just figured that since the RL is front wheel drive, it had a transverse mounted engine as well. I was just hoping that the Saturn's engine would not have VTEC... I just don't want to see a bunch a Vue's running about with big VTEC or Type R stickers..:twak:

BTW, I agree Pilot-1, now GM will finally have a reliable engine with low emissions, thanks to Honda.;)
BTW, The RL engine is not even VTEC.
It is basically a larger version of the original 3.2L Legend engine.

http://www.acura.com/models/model_perf_engine.asp?module=rl

BTW, I am the owner of a last generation Legend Coupe.

-Tat
 

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Pilot-1 said:
WARNING: Essay ahead :D



What a sad day for GM fans.:headshak:
could be GM plans to buy honda eventually...honda being a small company will have a problem competing against the big car companies and all small companise are being bought.

IMO eventually it will be GM, ford, toyota and diamler chrysler, VW(?). Small companies like BMW , honda etc will have a problem in compeating or will become marganalised..
 

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Discussion Starter #16
tatng said:


BTW, The RL engine is not even VTEC.
It is basically a larger version of the original 3.2L Legend engine.

http://www.acura.com/models/model_perf_engine.asp?module=rl

BTW, I am the owner of a last generation Legend Coupe.

-Tat
That was my whole point. That is why I was hoping for the RL engine because it's a 3.5L without VTEC, rather than the Pilot's 3.5L which has VTEC.

I am still amazed that Honda designed a FWD car with a longitudinal mounted engine. Maybe they were eventually going to convert it to RWD.
 

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I'm still wondering what lengths Honda has to go to to engineer an engine specifically for Saturn. How will they ever get it to burn 4 quarts of oil between changes. ;^)
 

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GreenMachine said:


That was my whole point. That is why I was hoping for the RL engine because it's a 3.5L without VTEC, rather than the Pilot's 3.5L which has VTEC.

I am still amazed that Honda designed a FWD car with a longitudinal mounted engine. Maybe they were eventually going to convert it to RWD.
Longitudinal mount engine improved the weight distribution of the Legend
because the center of gravity of the engine is behind the front axle.
Remember Legend used to mean sporty luxury sedan (the '93 230HP 6-speed GS) ?
There also used to be a rumor on a All wheel drive Legend but some how it never turn out to be real.


Tat
 

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could someone please help a car illiterate?? what is VTEC and does our pilot have it? please excuse my ignorance!! :8:
 

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tmcguinn1 said:
could someone please help a car illiterate?? what is VTEC and does our pilot have it? please excuse my ignorance!! :8:
VTEC is an acronym for Variable valve Timing and lift Electronic Control. It is a mechanism for optimizing air/fuel mixture flow through the engine.

Yes, the Pilot has it (as well as many other Honda's) and it works great. Kicks in about 4300RPM.


:2:
 
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