Honda Pilot - Honda Pilot Forums banner
1 - 20 of 29 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Original struts and shocks, tie rods, lower control arms replaced back when at 142K on it(2014). Now at 217K with new set of tires installed and went for alignment and readings were extremely out. (See picture attached)

Tech says no adjustment can be done until suspension is checked and rebuilt but he has no clear idea where to start when asked. (Pardon me but the tech sounds not knowledgeable enough). Car has no known accident or collision. Wheel vibrations noted despite after thorough balancing.

I am thinking maybe due to worn struts, shocks and possibly the springs too due to old age. Any ideas or advise how to tackle this issue is highly appreciated.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,316 Posts
I'm not an alignment expert by any means. I rely on shops to get it right. If your vehicle were badly out of alignment, it would continually be pulling one way or another. Are you having this issue?
Have you tested the integrity of your suspension? This is done by raising a wheel slightly off the ground, the grabbing the tire at the 3 and 9 o'clock position and give it a shake, back and forth. Is it profoundly loose? Do the same at the 6 and 12 o'clock position.
We can't expect an aged vehicle to not eventually need struts and rubber bushings replaced. Examine the upper and lower control arm bushings. Are they intact or cracked? (Same for rear) Take a few photos of these and post here if you want some opinions.
If your struts need to be replaced, they usually will rattle over rough terrain. You can swipe across the top of the strut with your finger. Is there hydraulic fluid leaking out?
 

·
Registered
2008 Honda Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
314 Posts
The fork? That's some insane amount of camber, and should absolutely be visible upon looking at the vehicle. My best guess to your problems is likely struts/springs, as if those aren't up to the task, the suspension geometry would result in extreme camber as the vehicle is sitting lower than it should.

Can you take some pictures of the vehicle and how it's sitting?
If you put the vehicle on level ground, and measure from the ground to the bottom of the frame rail (by the jack-up points), what do you measure in each corner?
How did the previous tires wear? Was it mainly on the inside of the wheel?
Also got any "junk in the trunk", or other cargo weight that can skew things?
 

·
Registered
2006 Honda Pilot 2WD
Joined
·
71 Posts
Take it to another shop. Obviously the one you are at lacks experience/competence. Nail Grease advice is the first thing to check. This test will give you a good idea of what is or is not going on.

I will add a few more comments. I have had an inner tie rod end go bad on me long before I expected it (about 60,000 miles) whereas all the other steering parts were fine. All of my front end parts were changed at the same time with same brand parts. I have also had the control arm bushings go bad. The original control arms were replaced at 200,000 or so miles. The replacements were replaced again around 300,000 miles. The replacements were obviously lower quality than the originals.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
570 Posts
(Pardon me but the tech sounds not knowledgeable enough).
I think that's your most immediate problem. Find another shop. Suspension work isn't mysterious in a car that hasn't been wrecked.

If the replacement LCA's were low-end models, the bushings might be done. I suggest you get underneath the vehicle with a good light and start looking for cracks in the rubber, as NailGrease suggests. At 217k, you got your money's worth from the struts - I would replace them with KYB's immediately..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Additonal info and update.

Prior to tire replacement, wear is mostly at front driver side on left outer shoulder. Pulling at left corrected after toe correction.

Now upon checking underneath, Suspensiont sill looks OK visually to me.. Those were put in at 142K.


A. Lower Control Arms were aftermarket since 2014. (no problem with previous alignment checks prior to this one)
B. Struts and shocks KYB since 2014.
C. Tie rods and sway bar stabilizer links OEM since 2014
D. Ride height equal all aorund at jack points.
E. No free play at 9-3 and 12-6 o'clock. *Some slack 9-3 probably due to steering rack play but not observed by the wheel hub.


Hope this pictures helps a lot. Nothing I can see obviously wrong at first glance but the alignment readings are at extremes.

Thanks for all your input.
Land vehicle Vehicle Car Motor vehicle Tire Auto part Rust Pipe Coil spring Auto part Tire Automotive wheel system Automotive tire Tire Automotive tire Wheel Auto part Automotive wheel system Auto part Automotive wheel system Wheel Vehicle Land vehicle Vehicle Car Automotive tire Sport utility vehicle Land vehicle Vehicle Car Automotive tire Tire Auto part Wheel Pliers Land vehicle Vehicle Car Sport utility vehicle Honda Auto part Rim Wheel
 

·
Registered
Nobili spiritus embiggens pequeño sparus tyre.
Joined
·
10,190 Posts
Just using eyeball assessment technology here, but my conclusion is that the shop's settings are extremely out of whack, not yours. Take it to a different place.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,316 Posts
Just using eyeball assessment technology here, but my conclusion is that the shop's settings are extremely out of whack, not yours. Take it to a different place.
141725

Nothing should be so far out that the alignment can't be performed.
 
  • Like
Reactions: levi

·
Registered
2008 Honda Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
314 Posts
Just using eyeball assessment technology here, but my conclusion is that the shop's settings are extremely out of whack, not yours. Take it to a different place.
View attachment 141725
Nothing should be so far out that the alignment can't be performed.
It looks like the vehicle might be sitting a little lower than it could be, but nothing crazy, and that doesn't look like a 40+ Degree Camber Angle, otherwise your car would be squatting like this: /-------\

So I agree with plplplpl and Nail Grease, either the technician did it wrong, or their machine is severely in need of proper calibration. (My guess is the guy who did it installed the reflectors incorrectly or something, so take it to another shop).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
312 Posts
I agree with what has already been said. Unless this Pilot has been modified and the front and rear tires are splayed out (45-degrees) I would find another shop. Those numbers are crazy on a stock vehicle.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
Thanks a lot for all of your input. I'm bringing it to another shop and get it done right.

If things got it right in another shop, ( I know it will...) I will have a discussion with the Honda service manager and complained about the incompetency of the tech. Definitely he needs re-training.
Maybe a deserve a sort of refund or credit from them. 😊 Unfortunately, it's a Honda dealership where I have an account of all my cars. Never have a problem with other services before but unfortunate with an inexperienced mechanic this time.

Will post an update on this.

Again. Thanks a lot. Be safe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
570 Posts
Unfortunately, it's a Honda dealership where I have an account of all my cars.
That's probably in your favor. They know you, you're a steady customer. As others have noted, if you just show them the report and ask if 40+ degrees seems realistic, I expect that they will figure out for themselves what to do about their tech (or their equipment), as well as take care of you better.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,316 Posts
That's probably in your favor. They know you, you're a steady customer. As others have noted, if you just show them the report and ask if 40+ degrees seems realistic, I expect that they will figure out for themselves what to do about their tech (or their equipment), as well as take care of you better.
Older vehicle.
This is typical of what some dealerships do. They are not happy just making $109. These tactics sometimes score them more work.
 
  • Like
Reactions: levi

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 · (Edited)
I agree. I can do my own repair
and/or maintenance within my capacity and help of my friend (mechanic). Only dealership or shop if needs a special tool. I have built trust with them but this incident is a bummer. I need to drop by one time and discuss it with the service manager my concern about the job and the tech.

The big question is if I will entrust my 3 cars to them in the future. Though isolated issue of mis diagnosing it.
 

·
Registered
2008 Honda Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
314 Posts
As others have noted, if you just show them the report and ask if 40+ degrees seems realistic, I expect that they will figure out for themselves what to do about their tech (or their equipment), as well as take care of you better.
40* degrees of camber would make him the king of Stance Nation, as he'd have more camber than even this guy.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Now this is REALISTIC.

Alignment check and done in another shop. Correction within specs done even the right rear camber. (It has aftermarket adjustable rear camber arms).

Now I have peace of mind and enjoy the ride with my trusty PILOT for 17 years.

Pic 1 Honda stealership
Pic 2 Firestone Tire Center

Text Diagram Plan Text Plan Parallel Diagram Text Design Pattern Text Joint Machine Plant Diagram
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
25 Posts
Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Thanks a million guys! Be safe!
 

·
Registered
Nobili spiritus embiggens pequeño sparus tyre.
Joined
·
10,190 Posts
So glad to hear you got to the bottom of this. (y) When outlier data is observed, it's good to run another test.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,316 Posts
Now this is REALISTIC.

Alignment check and done in another shop. Correction within specs done even the right rear camber. (It has aftermarket adjustable rear camber arms).

Now I have peace of mind and enjoy the ride with my trusty PILOT for 17 years.

Pic 1 Honda stealership
Pic 2 Firestone Tire Center

View attachment 141732 View attachment 141733 View attachment 141734 View attachment 141735
So....,
The BIG QUESTION
Incompetent Technician?
Or
A money grab attempt by a stealership?
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Top