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2023 Pilot vs Mazda CX90/70 vs. ?

15486 Views 265 Replies 31 Participants Last post by  TexAg91
My wife and I are still rocking our 2005 Pilot. We raised our family with it and it is still going strong with 197k. I am looking for a new family car and capacity is less of a factor now since 2 of our 3 kids drive. Usually we only have 2-4 total people riding anymore. I am planning on keeping the 05 for my youngest. We keep our cars a long time so reliability is very important. I love the idea of going smaller for more fuel efficiency and fun to drive characteristics but a smooth quiet ride is also important. What do you think of the new in-line 6 Mazda has coming in the cx90/70? What else is everyone considering?
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They're going straight for Acura's throat. I expect this to be substantially more expensive than the CX-9. Will probably start in the upper 40s/low 50s and go up to the upper 50s.
Pricing would be the elephant in the room. The CX-9 is priced at the lower end of the 3 row SUV spectrum, closer to the Subaru Ascent, even much cheaper than the traditional value oriented Palisade/ Telluride especially at the top trims. I expect the CX-90 to be competitively priced. I would be interested in the GT trim that should come with all the gizmos and must-have items sans the fluff in the top Signature trim.
 

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Pricing would be the elephant in the room. The CX-9 is priced at the lower end of the 3 row SUV spectrum, closer to the Subaru Ascent, even much cheaper than the traditional value oriented Palisade/ Telluride especially at the top trims. I expect the CX-90 to be competitively priced. I would be interested in the GT trim that should come with all the gizmos and must- items sans the fluff in the top Signature trim.
I think look at the Explorer ST and Durango R/T and SRT as your sort of min/max for the price range. If they offer that engine at a sub $50k price, my wife will have one of those instead of most likely another Pilot.
 

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Here's the picture they posted. Looks nice enough so far, I do quite like the way the CX-50 looks and if they can scale that up I'd like it.


Tire Land vehicle Car Vehicle Automotive lighting
 

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Looks interesting, thanks for sharing the updates. I am looking forward to fuel effeciency numbers. I also wonder if "recommended premium fuel" for this Mazda i6 is similar to the Ford Raptor/ Lincoln Navigator twin turbo v6 where premium is recommended but not required. With it, you take a slight performance hit by using regular unleaded, but you obviously save a lot at the pump. As much as I'd love to drive an "enthusiast" vehicle while carting my kids all over the place, I'm more interested in saving money. Maybe the PHEV will be a good option for fiscally-challenged people like me. :p
 

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I also wonder if "recommended premium fuel" for this Mazda i6 is similar to the Ford Raptor/ Lincoln Navigator twin turbo v6 where premium is recommended but not required.
I'm certain that it will be like Mazda's existing products that recommend and not require premium for best performance at wide-open throttle. My '20 CX-5, for example, was rated at 227 HP and 310 lb-ft on 87 octane and 250 HP and 320 lb-ft on 93 octane for a little more torque and a more horsepower, BUT...the 87 map developed its peak torque at a lower RPM than the 93 map so 87 was actually better for driving at less than WOT. I couldn't feel any difference when I switched between 87 and 93 octane and suspect only a race or instrumented could reveal any difference. My '19 MX-5 Miata was initially filled with 87 octane by the dealer. There was no obvious difference in performance after refueling with 93 octane.
 

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Looks interesting, thanks for sharing the updates. I am looking forward to fuel effeciency numbers. I also wonder if "recommended premium fuel" for this Mazda i6 is similar to the Ford Raptor/ Lincoln Navigator twin turbo v6 where premium is recommended but not required. With it, you take a slight performance hit by using regular unleaded, but you obviously save a lot at the pump. As much as I'd love to drive an "enthusiast" vehicle while carting my kids all over the place, I'm more interested in saving money. Maybe the PHEV will be a good option for fiscally-challenged people like me. :p
The PHEV version has similar numbers ( 327 hp, 387 ft-Ib torque), but with a beefier 129 KW electric motor, so should suit you better. The only question is at what price?

Here's a link to speculative report:

 

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I got spoiled by the assembly and material quality of my CX-5 Signature and MX-5 Miata compared to my Hondas which look and feel cheaply-built - something that seems to be getting worse with Honda. :(
Not just Honda. Many others have as well. Even BMW starting skimping
It's inline 6 with turbo(s?), it's going to be MDX type S pricing category, not pilot.
going to be a tough sell at $70k
 

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Discussion Starter · #172 ·
That’s the hope. I’m hoping low 50s. In the 60s you’re talking BMW X5, Benz GLE and Audi Q7 money
I’m hoping the same thing but I think this is Mazda’s attempt to complete against the luxury class (BMW, MB, Audi). What little we know so far it seems to be paralleling the X5. My guess is it will range from mid 50’s to mid 60’s. I mean a loaded 2023 Pilot Elite is over 50k right? It will definitely be a tough sell unless it undercuts the luxury brands I mentioned. I personally will not commit to any new car until the CX90 is fully revealed.
 

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I think there will be several trim levels with this turbo I6 available (at first) only in the trim above signature (meridian?). That trim will be much closer to $70k. The signature and other trims will get the turbo 4 or a non-turbo I6 if they have it. As much as I want that turbo I6 there is no way they sell it in the low 50k range
 

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I think there will be several trim levels with this turbo I6 available (at first) only in the trim above signature (meridian?). That trim will be much closer to $70k. The signature and other trims will get the turbo 4 or a non-turbo I6 if they have it. As much as I want that turbo I6 there is no way they sell it in the low 50k range
That is possible. They may take a page from Genesis and how they've priced the GV80, with the average transaction price in the upper 60s.
I will say this. If it is in the mid to upper 50s, I will be interested. Beyond that, we're entering BMW X5 territory and I would gladly get that or even the MDX Type S. It is a completely different playing field in the upper 60s and low 70s where the badge on the hood has a lot of weight, more so than the impressive spec sheet of this CX90.
 

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That is possible. They may take a page from Genesis and how they've priced the GV80, with the average transaction price in the upper 60s.
I will say this. If it is in the mid to upper 50s, I will be interested. Beyond that, we're entering BMW X5 territory and I would gladly get that or even the MDX Type S. It is a completely different playing field in the upper 60s and low 70s where the badge on the hood has a lot of weight, more so than the impressive spec sheet of this CX90.
If Mazda is going to package and market the CX-90 as a pseudo-luxury car, why not create a new brand (Like Hyundai did with Genesis), then they can price it as such. Until then, Mazda cars are gonna be seen as mainstream sub-luxury, it would be a tough sell to price them any different. They could keep the CX-9 as mainstream and upmarket the CX-90 (ideally with a different name though) and brand it as a luxury car. Still, I would think it would be cheaper than the soon-to-be-revealed Kia EV9 (a full electric) since it is only a hybrid and PHEV.
 

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I still maintain I don't have the love affair with Mazda as a premium or semi-premium brand that others do and I personally think they will fail at that market like VW did. Personally I think the Telluride and Palisade are setting the pricing for the market and if Mazda exceeds that for a similarly equipped vehicle they are instantly cutting a ton of market share from even considering them. The Turbo I6 could bump it up to Explorer ST and Durango R/T levels as I said before but I again think they will not sell well at MDX/GV80 price points.
 
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More minor releases on the CX90. You do get glimpses of it and there is a few minutes worth of talk on the engine, gearbox, and suspension. Not a lot and is more of a tease.

This does look like front double wishbone suspension and has brake based torque vectoring, not as advanced as Honda's mechanical unit. That being said, the CX90 comes with the inherent advantage of a longitudinal placement of the engine and will be more balanced to drive. Hoping this is competitively priced.

Mazda CX90
 

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Anyone else watch the YouTube from Jonathan Sewell? Sounds like he says those I6 figures announced this week are the mild hybrid version and NOT the high output? So from what he is saying there is a high output version with more ho/tq still to come?

If that is true it makes me think two things.

1) The CX-90 with the mild hybrid I6 might actually be cost competitive with the upper Piloy trims.
2) Mazda will have a CX-90 version competitive with the MDX Type-S.

Again all this with the disclaimers that it comes from YouTube and a dealer so I give it 5/10 on a scale of being credible.
 

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Discussion Starter · #179 ·
Anyone else watch the YouTube from Jonathan Sewell? Sounds like he says those I6 figures announced this week are the mild hybrid version and NOT the high output? So from what he is saying there is a high output version with more ho/tq still to come?

If that is true it makes me think two things.

1) The CX-90 with the mild hybrid I6 might actually be cost competitive with the upper Piloy trims.
2) Mazda will have a CX-90 version competitive with the MDX Type-S.

Again all this with the disclaimers that it comes from YouTube and a dealer so I give it 5/10 on a scale of being credible.
I do watch Jonathan’s videos. I’m not sure about HO version. I’m hoping they reveal all their plans on Jan 31st. My family would be plenty satisfied with 340hp but if HO is more it sure would be fun.
 
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