Honda Pilot - Honda Pilot Forums banner
1 - 20 of 20 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
My daughter bought a used 2019 Honda pilot. it had slid off the road and the airbags blew. i replaced the cosmetic issues and replaced airbags and control module. We used all OEM parts and had the local Honda dealership do a complete reboot of airbags and had all systems checked for dependability. she drove the car for 10,000 miles and was coming home from work, turned a corner and the engine started making noise. she stopped and called me and started the car. it had a bad rattle like a spun rod bearing. she was a mile from her house so she drove it home.

I went to her house the next weekend to take a look. I had her husband start the car while i was at the engine. it sounded so bad, I had him turn it off. I didn't have time to take it apart so i started looking for common problems with her engine. I couldn't find anything that was relevant so i went back the next weekend to take it apart. I took off the oil pan and windage tray to find a broken crankshaft. I had never seen a crank broken especially on an engine with less than 50k before and was surprised. I contacted the local Honda dealership that looked at it 6 months earlier and they told me that they must have ran it out of oil. i had to drain the oil to take it apart so i knew it was full before i started removing anything. I didn't have the time or tools to take off the main caps but did take off a few rod caps and the bearings looked brand new.

that being said,

I need to get her car running and have found a few used engines in the $2500-$4000 dollar range with approx 50k on them. It would take me a few weeks to get one though. Today I found a 2016 Acura MDX close to my house that was wrecked for less than half the price with 40k on the engine. I am not a Honda expert but i did learn that her car has a J35Y6 engine but the Acura has a J35Y5 engine. does anyone know if i could use the Acura engine even if i need to swap sensors etc? The Honda Pilot has a six speed but the Acura has a 9 speed transmission. does anyone know if the bell housing is the difference on the two engines? I cannot find the differences online

hope everyone doesn't think I'm crazy and I can even send pictures of the broken crank if you don't believe me

I have worked on several cars and engines. I even thought of rebuilding the engine until I found the broken crank.

does anyone have any advice?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
960 Posts
I would be fighting with Honda to cover it under the Powertrain warranty of 5 years/60000 miles! They would have to prove that the engine damage was caused by lack of oil.

Yes, the Powertrain warranty follows the car regardless of how many previous owners unless a salvage or rebuilt title has been issued in most cases.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
46 Posts
+1 to power train warranty claim

How many miles? (you mentioned <50k)

When diagnosing engine failure yourself did you pull codes?

Did you keep the oil you drained? (condition and amount of oil in the engine might be important - you can have that oil analyzed by independent lab, e.g. Blackstone, etc and see if there are any signs of early engine failure; that may or may not help your case, if there was)
Do you have proof of regular servicing & oil changes?
If you did these yourself, do you have receipts of oil/filter, etc and record of dates/mileage when you did it?

(also, it's hindsight, I know, but if suspecting any kind of failure inside of warranty period, if you are adventurous enough to start tearing into it yourself to diagnose, I would be documenting everything, at every step along the way, i.e. pictures, videos of everything as it's being taken apart so there is NO wiggle room for Honda, et al, to say you caused this somehow)
 

·
Registered
2008 Honda Pilot EX-L 2013 Honda Pilot EX-L
Joined
·
1,773 Posts
Shouldn’t have started doing the work yourself.

You have no way to prove that there was oil in the engine now. Honda will not help you.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
43 Posts
jbhonda, Just some clarifying questions. Does your Daughter’s Pilot have a rebuilt title. If so, I don’t believe Honda will honor any warranty on the vehicle. If not, it may be difficult to get Honda to provide any relief, either warranty or goodwill. By tearing into the engine prior to having Honda look at it might be an uphill battle. Good luck and I hope you can get some resolution.

21Elite
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
49 Posts
If you're doing the engine swap route, also take a look at the current generation Passport, Ridgeline, and Odyssey. At least these three uses the same engine and similar transmission.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Hey guys, thanks for all the replies.

For beginners the car was a CL find and does not have a rebuilt or salvage title.

The girl that previous owned the car drove it down an icy road and slid off into a ditch. the car had damage that was fixable so we bought it for a reasonable price and invested 6-8 thousand to get it back to no damage. its expensive to buy all OEM Honda parts. if it was scratched or dented we replaced it all.

I had my kids take it to Honda to get it all checked out and they also did all the recall checks etc.

I was happy that my daughter had a car that was safe for my grand children.

They have made multiple trips with the car and have put over 8k on it before this happened.

As previously mentioned I had contacted the service manager at the Missoula Honda dealership and they told me that it would cost us more to have them do the work than if we attempted to do it ourselves. Never did he mention that the car had a drive-train warranty and now I even more upset. All of the work i have did was under the direction of the Honda service manager. we have not touched it after i found what was making the noise.
we do still have the oil but when we removed the oil pan there is shavings in the bottom. but how can you not when the crankshaft broke and was moving around. who knows all the damage that is inside the lower end.

I was originally thinking that the wreck had did some damage and i was going to find a spun bearing or signs of lack of oil. i don't know what to think when i found a broken crankshaft and the rod bearings looked good.

I find myself very let down but we knew buying a car with damage was a gamble.

do you guys think we should still get a hold of Honda corporate themselves for advice? or do you think they will try to sweep this under the rug?

Are we are going to have to resolve the issue ourselves?

what a mess
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter · #9 ·
If you're doing the engine swap route, also take a look at the current generation Passport, Ridgeline, and Odyssey. At least these three uses the same engine and similar transmission.
yes, i have looked far and wide for all cars with the J35Y6 engine.


J35Y6 VCM
  • 2015-2020 Acura TLX.
  • 2016+ Honda Pilot.
  • 2017+ Honda Ridgeline.
  • 2018+ Honda Odyssey (North America)
  • 2019+ Honda Passport.
the only engines i could find were from wrecking yards. this engine is too new for the JDM program
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
960 Posts
I would talk with the service manager first and let him know you have the warranty still in place. It is on him telling you it would cost more for them to do the work on the engine without letting you know about the warranty. If nothing moves forward on that end then contact Honda of America. I wouldn't wait too long but would be on the phone or visiting the local dealer ASAP. They can tell if the engine failed due to a manufacturing defect or abuse such as lack of maintenance or oil. Previous accident was fixed by you but work such as module resets done by the dealer and they even inspected the car?

No salvage or rebuilt title you should be ok having warranty remaining on the 5 year 60000 mile power train. You might even want to have it towed to that dealer for them to inspect the engine
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
81 Posts
I would also open a case with Honda of America. They were able to help me resolve an issue with my local dealer/service department when they started giving me the run-around.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
hey guys,
I talked with my daughter and we totally agree with what you are saying.

I'm sure if they owed money on the car they would have a couple representatives helping to make sure this is done appropriately. they own this car free and clear so they are worried for their personal rights or authority

who has dealt with Honda of America before?
If we go that route will they take the car, dissemble the engine and give us a lame excuse? Will they then charge us thousands for their time? how can a car manufacturer do the investigation on why the crankshaft failed? how does this work? does a third party investigator get involved?

does anyone have the contact to an honest person at Honda?

I am worried that my daughter isn't going to get dealt with properly and she will have charges she cannot afford. does anyone know if their are attorneys that help with these situations? are there any legal representatives in this forum?

How do we as consumers know we are getting what we thought we were getting?

concerned
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
854 Posts
hey guys,
I talked with my daughter and we totally agree with what you are saying.

I'm sure if they owed money on the car they would have a couple representatives helping to make sure this is done appropriately. they own this car free and clear so they are worried for their personal rights or authority

who has dealt with Honda of America before?
If we go that route will they take the car, dissemble the engine and give us a lame excuse? Will they then charge us thousands for their time? how can a car manufacturer do the investigation on why the crankshaft failed? how does this work? does a third party investigator get involved?

does anyone have the contact to an honest person at Honda?

I am worried that my daughter isn't going to get dealt with properly and she will have charges she cannot afford. does anyone know if their are attorneys that help with these situations? are there any legal representatives in this forum?

How do we as consumers know we are getting what we thought we were getting?

concerned
Youd have to authorize work. They can’t just look at the car and send you a $10k charge. Typically the worst you’re looking at is a diag fee which is us an hour. Leave the oil pan off and tell them you drained the oil and dropped the pan before you realized it maybe under warranty. Nothing says that ONLY Honda can touch the car to be covered. I’d be honest and upfront with them and see what the dealer suggests. If you don’t like the answers from one dealer call another until you find one you trust and feel like will have your best interests in mind working it with Honda.
 

·
Registered
2010 Pilot EXL
Joined
·
140 Posts
My daughter bought a used 2019 Honda pilot. it had slid off the road and the airbags blew. i replaced the cosmetic issues and replaced airbags and control module. We used all OEM parts and had the local Honda dealership do a complete reboot of airbags and had all systems checked for dependability. she drove the car for 10,000 miles and was coming home from work, turned a corner and the engine started making noise. she stopped and called me and started the car. it had a bad rattle like a spun rod bearing. she was a mile from her house so she drove it home.

I went to her house the next weekend to take a look. I had her husband start the car while i was at the engine. it sounded so bad, I had him turn it off. I didn't have time to take it apart so i started looking for common problems with her engine. I couldn't find anything that was relevant so i went back the next weekend to take it apart. I took off the oil pan and windage tray to find a broken crankshaft. I had never seen a crank broken especially on an engine with less than 50k before and was surprised. I contacted the local Honda dealership that looked at it 6 months earlier and they told me that they must have ran it out of oil. i had to drain the oil to take it apart so i knew it was full before i started removing anything. I didn't have the time or tools to take off the main caps but did take off a few rod caps and the bearings looked brand new.

that being said,

I need to get her car running and have found a few used engines in the $2500-$4000 dollar range with approx 50k on them. It would take me a few weeks to get one though. Today I found a 2016 Acura MDX close to my house that was wrecked for less than half the price with 40k on the engine. I am not a Honda expert but i did learn that her car has a J35Y6 engine but the Acura has a J35Y5 engine. does anyone know if i could use the Acura engine even if i need to swap sensors etc? The Honda Pilot has a six speed but the Acura has a 9 speed transmission. does anyone know if the bell housing is the difference on the two engines? I cannot find the differences online

hope everyone doesn't think I'm crazy and I can even send pictures of the broken crank if you don't believe me

I have worked on several cars and engines. I even thought of rebuilding the engine until I found the broken crank.

does anyone have any advice?
I suspect the engine damage was caused when the car went off the road. Airbags do not go off if the vehicle slid laterally. Did it roll? If it came to rest in a gully laying on its side and the engine continued to run, the bearing damage was done then. A little bearing damage became major damage. Driving it home that last mile is what broke the crank, not that it really mattered at that point as the engine was toast. I'm confident the cams were ruined as well.

With the history of the car, I think it unlikely Honda will replace this engine. As you bought it as a salvage vehicle, I trust you got it cheap, but without warranty?

Astrobuf
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
39 Posts
I suspect the engine damage was caused when the car went off the road. Airbags do not go off if the vehicle slid laterally. Did it roll? If it came to rest in a gully laying on its side and the engine continued to run, the bearing damage was done then. A little bearing damage became major damage. Driving it home that last mile is what broke the crank, not that it really mattered at that point as the engine was toast. I'm confident the cams were ruined as well.

With the history of the car, I think it unlikely Honda will replace this engine. As you bought it as a salvage vehicle, I trust you got it cheap, but without warranty?

Astrobuf
Someone didn't read the rest of the thread.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
52 Posts
I suspect the engine damage was caused when the car went off the road. Airbags do not go off if the vehicle slid laterally. Did it roll? If it came to rest in a gully laying on its side and the engine continued to run, the bearing damage was done then. A little bearing damage became major damage. Driving it home that last mile is what broke the crank, not that it really mattered at that point as the engine was toast. I'm confident the cams were ruined as well.

With the history of the car, I think it unlikely Honda will replace this engine. As you bought it as a salvage vehicle, I trust you got it cheap, but without warranty?

Astrobuf
The car has to roll on its side or completely upside down for all the airbags to deploy. Especially the ones in the headliner. I work on airbags at my dealer and if you remove the airbag controller still plugged in and turn it over by mistake, it will deploy the airbags, which is simulating the car rolling over or on its side. So yea, if that's the case, and the engine is still running, the oil is no longer in the oil pan and engine is starved of oil.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
39 Posts
The car has to roll on its side or completely upside down for all the airbags to deploy. Especially the ones in the headliner. I work on airbags at my dealer and if you remove the airbag controller still plugged in and turn it over by mistake, it will deploy the airbags, which is simulating the car rolling over or on its side. So yea, if that's the case, and the engine is still running, the oil is no longer in the oil pan and engine is starved of oil.
He never said all the airbags (or even the ones in the headliner) deployed...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
52 Posts
He never said all the airbags (or even the ones in the headliner) deployed...
Why I sayed " if that's the case" . we don't know. Even if they didn't and the car was sitting at a very steep angle in the ditch and the engine was left running to keep the heater going till help arrives, during that time bearings could get damaged due to extreme angle of the oil pan could cause oil starvation. Just a possibility...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
860 Posts
The car has to roll on its side or completely upside down for all the airbags to deploy. Especially the ones in the headliner.
Not true, the veh doesn't have to roll or be on it's side to deploy curtains. Many side hits will also set of the curtains on that side as well.
Weirdest one I had was a 13 2 door accord that set off every bag in the car except the drivers steering wheel bag. Both Honda and Nhtsa showed up and found the system operated correctly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
960 Posts
Any follow up on what's happening?
 
1 - 20 of 20 Posts
Top