The dreaded Torque Shudder

[Brolan]

Originally Posted by surfsup

I have a friend who joined this forum wanting to buy a new 2013 Pilot Touring. Amongst all the Pilot niggles, he was most concerned about the growing "dreaded shudder" complaints here.

I told him my thoughts on the subject, which I posted in another thread and won't repeat here. Suffice it to say, I told him the best thing I could do for him was to take him out for a drive and replicate the "dreaded shudder" sensation for him. Mine occurs at about 40-45 mpg only and it is very slight - you have to really turn up your senses to feel it.

Bottom line is, when the ride was over, he laughed - we both did. He is getting his new 2013 Pilot Touring in May.

Final thoughts, if Honda ever provides a fix for this, I am positive we will be looking at a significant MPG increase in our Pilots. As such I would absolutely decline the modification unless it's accompanied by an on/off switch.

Don't you mean mileage decrease? I think its lugging the engine right now to get the better MPG, it they back off on the VCM the MPG should decrease.

[surfsup]

Originally Posted by Brolan

Don't you mean mileage decrease? I think its lugging the engine right now to get the better MPG, it they back off on the VCM the MPG should decrease.

yep, fixt, thanks!

[boyce89976]

Originally Posted by surfsup

I have a friend who joined this forum wanting to buy a new 2013 Pilot Touring. Amongst all the Pilot niggles, he was most concerned about the growing "dreaded shudder" complaints here.

I told him my thoughts on the subject, which I posted in another thread and won't repeat here. Suffice it to say, I told him the best thing I could do for him was to take him out for a drive and replicate the "dreaded shudder" sensation for him. Mine occurs at about 40-45 mpg only and it is very slight - you have to really turn up your senses to feel it.

Bottom line is, when the ride was over, he laughed - we both did. He is getting his new 2013 Pilot Touring in May.

Final thoughts, if Honda ever provides a fix for this, I am positive we will be looking at a significant MPG decrease in our Pilots. As such I would absolutely decline the modification unless it's accompanied by an on/off switch.

That's great, but your friend might be PO'd at you when he gets his Pilot and it shudders like mine does. They're are clearly less severe, and more severe, cases. Yours must be one of the less severe cases... congrats. Mine is more severe... to the point my wife gets car sick when she rides in my Pilot. Some days it's not so bad, others, it feels like a wheel is loose and about to come off the hub.

[rweatwork]

The 'shudder' on my 2013 seems to lessen when I use E-0 (ethanol free) gas instead of the standard Central Illinois E-10 blend of 87 octane fuel. I still hear a change in the engine's pitch, but the steering wheel doesn't vibrate.

Has anyone else tried this?

[RinconVTR]

Originally Posted by boyce89976

That's great, but your friend might be PO'd at you when he gets his Pilot and it shudders like mine does. They're are clearly less severe, and more severe, cases. Yours must be one of the less severe cases... congrats. Mine is more severe... to the point my wife gets car sick when she rides in my Pilot. Some days it's not so bad, others, it feels like a wheel is loose and about to come off the hub.

Have you considered the issue may not be the transmission at all???

[pvpilotex]

Originally Posted by Strate L O S S

I've had "it" without the ECO light lit.

It's no big deal, torque converter lockup plus the active mounts. Well for me it is barely noticeable and I'm confident that others exaggerate it a bit.

Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

I notice a slight shudder in my 2012 Pilot EX, but it when it goes into and out of economy mode. Sometimes I notice it, and sometimes I don't. I don't really mind it and figure I won't notice it at all one of these days. I bought it in Sep. 2012 and have less than 2,000 miles on it. However, the more I drive it, the more I like it.

[2ndPilot]

I took my 2013 Pilot EXL to the dealer today to ask about a vibration I've noticed when the VCM (ECO) mode light comes on. I was told that their Senior Technician said Honda knows about the problem and is working on a computer fix. I was told it has something to do with the computer shutting off 3 of the cylinders at lower speeds and it might take up to a year for a fix. They also said it does not happen in all of the Pilots and that it will no cause any problems.

[surfsup]

Originally Posted by boyce89976

That's great, but your friend might be PO'd at you when he gets his Pilot and it shudders like mine does. They're are clearly less severe, and more severe, cases. Yours must be one of the less severe cases... congrats. Mine is more severe... to the point my wife gets car sick when she rides in my Pilot. Some days it's not so bad, others, it feels like a wheel is loose and about to come off the hub.

My friend is going to make damn sure he gets a good test drive due to these threads, which is what is so great about forums like this. Yes, you are correct, I was fortunate.

However, you should be able to find a Honda rep that will have no problem with observing 'sickening' or 'loose wheel' shudder sensations, and admitting you have a legitimate concern. Being your problem is that noticeably bad and if Honda absolutely refuses to help you, there are legions of lawyers that will take your case if you're still under warranty (or filed your complaints under warranty).

Evidently we can only go on your posts here and I don't doubt a word you have said. As such, you definitely have a really bad problem and a really bad dealer. You need to take whatever (well documented) steps necessary to resolve this. Keep us posted.

[surfsup]

Originally Posted by 2ndPilot

I took my 2013 Pilot EXL to the dealer today to ask about a vibration I've noticed when the VCM (ECO) mode light comes on. I was told that their Senior Technician said Honda knows about the problem and is working on a computer fix. I was told it has something to do with the computer shutting off 3 of the cylinders at lower speeds and it might take up to a year for a fix. They also said it does not happen in all of the Pilots and that it will no cause any problems.

It might help some of the other forum members if you could relay some specific info like the dealerships name, the senior tech's name, etc. I don't want to put you on the spot, but some of these guys don't seem to be getting this feedback from their dealers. Thanks for the good info

[dpbaillie]

Ok, so my case is now opened with Honda and I am expecting the case manager to call me by the end of tomorrow. The dealership communicated my issue with Honda and relayed that Honda stated the the problem appears to be worse in some cars than others, but they consider the problem to be normal.

So, I am asking that Honda describe technically, with supporting literature, what is causing the rumbling and vibrating in my Pilot. I will also ask why this is considered normal when in other Pilots the problem is less severe or doesn't exist. Finally, I will ask why they feel this has no long term impact on the life expectancy of the vehicle and to respond to the impact that this problem will have on the the resale value.

[john segal]

Go for it DB,
My feeling is ALL pilots have it.
Some owners just don't feel it! Thats fine for them.
Some owners will drive thousands of miles with tires out of balance and not notice. I know, they're friends of mine!
My problem with Honda is they used the most complicated system to wring very little if any mileage out of the car. When other makes use 6 and 7 and variable speed transmissions, Honda sticks with 5. Then resorts to shutting down cylinders and then needs to add the "active noise cancellation" to mask the vibes and sounds it emits. The Ford Explorer I just test drove gets as good mpg and is much quieter Without all Honda's mechanical wizardry.

[dpbaillie]

John,

This is my first Honda and I don't really care what technology they choose to use provided it works as it's supposed to. We can compare to other manufacturer's, but if Honda got it right I don't think we'd be complaining about their technology. The issue for me is for them to stand behind their product, determine what's wrong. and fix it.

[mudbog]

No car manufacturer is perfect. Case in point -check out the all the steering complaints on the Explorer.

[john segal]

Muddog, Good to know.
These forums are great.

[RinconVTR]

Originally Posted by dpbaillie

Ok, so my case is now opened with Honda and I am expecting the case manager to call me by the end of tomorrow. The dealership communicated my issue with Honda and relayed that Honda stated the the problem appears to be worse in some cars than others, but they consider the problem to be normal.

So, I am asking that Honda describe technically, with supporting literature, what is causing the rumbling and vibrating in my Pilot. I will also ask why this is considered normal when in other Pilots the problem is less severe or doesn't exist. Finally, I will ask why they feel this has no long term impact on the life expectancy of the vehicle and to respond to the impact that this problem will have on the the resale value.

Honda will provide you with nothing. Not in writing. Not in compensation. Nothing.

You will get the problem fixed (as they see fit) or a verbal denial.