The dreaded Torque Shudder

[tangotango99]

Originally Posted by mudbog

Explain in detail please how the VM in the '13 Accord is different than the Pilot.

Honda’s Variable Cylinder Management (VCM) is standard on V-6 sedans and now also works over a wider range of engine loads to improve efficiency; when it’s active, it silences three cylinders. (The previous version could deactivate two or three cylinders.) like the Pilot. now the bad news my friends 13 accord have a mild vib. issue

[mudbog]

It's sounds like Honda just more aggressively activates VCM and they dropped the 4 cylinder mode. I wonder if getting rid of the 4 cylinder mode was an attempt to get rid of the VCM vibration. So did you test drive a '13 Accord and notice the mild vibration issue? I don't suppose they added a way to deactivate VCM did they?

[tangotango99]

Originally Posted by mudbog

It's sounds like Honda just more aggressively activates VCM and they dropped the 4 cylinder mode. I wonder if getting rid of the 4 cylinder mode was an attempt to get rid of the VCM vibration. So did you test drive a '13 Accord and notice the mild vibration issue? I don't suppose they added a way to deactivate VCM did they?

It belong to a friend of mine, I will ask him after work

[Wisconsin]

Originally Posted by RinconVTR

What year is it?

2013.

I'm guessing that the extra power in the RDX combined with it being more aerodynamic and a lot lighter makes the engine not work as hard when VCM kicks in. Since the engine isn't working as hard as in in the Pilot, there is less vibration.

That's my theory at least.

[dpbaillie]

Picked up my Pilot from dealer. Annoying dash squeak is hopefully resolved. As for the judder, the dealership has opened a case with Honda to try to obtain some information. The believe eventually Honda will address this issue, but enough noise needs to be made. Hopefully, with the case NOW open, we can at least try to determine exactly what is rumbling, vibrating, etc.

[1YESfan]

Never had much of an issue with my 11 and the vcm is working just the way it's suppose to but the more I read these type of threads, the more I start to wonder. ;-)

[RinconVTR]

Originally Posted by Wisconsin

2013.

I'm guessing that the extra power in the RDX combined with it being more aerodynamic and a lot lighter makes the engine not work as hard when VCM kicks in. Since the engine isn't working as hard as in in the Pilot, there is less vibration.

That's my theory at least.

That was my EXACT thought when the Accord comments came in too!

Well, at least we have one known open case with Honda for the issue, and a forum member who will hopefully report their findings, if any!

[boyce89976]

Originally Posted by RinconVTR

Is there a single case on here where Honda has confirmed the feeling is not normal?

Is there a single case on here in which an owner found another identical Pilot on the lot which operated far better than theirs? If so, what happened from there?

In my case:
1> Yes, Honda svc manager, techs and service writer have all confirmed it's not normal.

2> Yes, I have driven both 4WD and 2WD models that don't exhibit the issue. However, mine didn't exhibit the issue either until the first service was performed at 7500 miles.

[RinconVTR]

Originally Posted by boyce89976

In my case:
1> Yes, Honda svc manager, techs and service writer have all confirmed it's not normal.

2> Yes, I have driven both 4WD and 2WD models that don't exhibit the issue. However, mine didn't exhibit the issue either until the first service was performed at 7500 miles.

So, did you open a case with Honda, having the dealer behind you?????

[dpbaillie]

Originally Posted by RinconVTR

So, did you open a case with Honda, having the dealer behind you?????

Just yesterday I had the opportunity to drive the service manager's 2013 pilot for the day, and yes, there's significant difference between his vehicle and mine. His exhibited the rumble only a couple of times while my pilot does it constantly.

There are times with my pilot that the rumbing/vibration will last at least 10 seconds. And then there is the frequency that it occurring. The difference between the two was a lot. I would actually accept the limited amount of rumbling that was exhibited by the other pilot.

A case was being opened with Honda and I will be returning to the dealer to follow up and take the service manager for a drive in my pilot.

[boyce89976]

Originally Posted by RinconVTR

So, did you open a case with Honda, having the dealer behind you?????

Yes, the case was opened back in October. They even did some diagnostic data recording all afternoon on mine and sent the data to Honda. Honda engineers said the data is all "normal". Service manager agreed to 3x flush the tranny fluid with each oil change until Honda has a software update.

[RinconVTR]

Have you both spoken directly with Honda about the case and received a case#? Or has all communication been with the dealer?

I'm not sure what is right or wrong fior any given issue, but I can say in my history it was far more beneficial to know the case number and be able to speak with Honda reps directly. I assure you, not everything makes it to Honda from the dealer, accurately.

[dpbaillie]

Rincon, I intend to visit the dealer tomorrow to follow-up on their submitting the case. I would expect feedback from Honda by now, so I'm on top of it. I want to provide the dealership with the opportunity to handle it. Otherwise, the relationship then becomes strained and I'd prefer we work on the collaboratively. So far I have reached beyond the service writer and now have the service manager's attention. He's stepped up so far.

When the service writer tried to dismiss my issue of the squeaking dash, the service manager became involved and had the issue fixed. So , kudos to him and lets allow him the opportunity to work with Honda on the more pressing issue.

[surfsup]

I have a friend who joined this forum wanting to buy a new 2013 Pilot Touring. Amongst all the Pilot niggles, he was most concerned about the growing "dreaded shudder" complaints here.

I told him my thoughts on the subject, which I posted in another thread and won't repeat here. Suffice it to say, I told him the best thing I could do for him was to take him out for a drive and replicate the "dreaded shudder" sensation for him. Mine occurs at about 40-45 mpg only and it is very slight - you have to really turn up your senses to feel it.

Bottom line is, when the ride was over, he laughed - we both did. He is getting his new 2013 Pilot Touring in May.

Final thoughts, if Honda ever provides a fix for this, I am positive we will be looking at a significant MPG decrease in our Pilots. As such I would absolutely decline the modification unless it's accompanied by an on/off switch.

[1YESfan]

I'm wondering if more women are more sensitive to this "vibration" issue rather than men? ;-)