New Pilots are pieces of $hit!

[EmptyTank]

Originally Posted by RinconVTR

Yep. I've been noticing this more and more here the last 6 months.

Problem is, it's not just the trolls that leave. A poster going by "miamidude" claimed to have solved the "moan at low speeds when A/C is on" problem (apparently with rubber flat washers on the steering pump mounting bracket) but that was his only-ever post and he never came back to give details. Without some sort of follow-up, it's hard to know if he made it up or not. Would have rather seen a procedure with pictures!

[Tmuchacho]

Gents, it is quite funny what the OP has created here. The title of his original post was obnoxious, and that really isn't the proper way to get your point across. There are so many things I do like about this vehicle, despite its shortcomings. I just got home and experienced the highest MPG I've ever seen since I bought the car (now 32K). Was on fumes and filled her up, drove the remaining 40 miles to home and the display read 27.9. Now this is flat roads in the low country, 40-50 MPH and cruise control for most of the trip (last 3-4 miles locked in the cruise at 35MPH). So there's no question the VCM does what it's suppose to, it's just what you have to put up with during the process. I have found when in cruise control, the symptoms some of us don't like are minimized, until there is a slight incline and load on the engine and it causes the cylinder changing. FYI, the Regional rep that rode in my car (passenger seat) did admit to complaints similar to mine, and as I remember - I was able to get him to admit that some do it worse than others, however, the bottom line with him was that it was a "characteristic of the vehicle". I'll be going in for service next month and I'm going to request another Regional Rep visit and this time I'll insist that he drive the car (want this done before the 36K mark).

[Tmuchacho]

Ok, found that Odyssey site - Honda Odyssey Forum : Odyssey Minivan Forums. In the search box, key in VCM long term reliability, only if you're interested or curious. There are 4 or 5 pages of posts, some relating to the earlier oil consumption issue. As it turned out, somebody tried the fellows idea of removing the oil sensors and plugging them but it didn't work. There are some engine pictures there from people that have disconnected the wires and are happy as I was with the way the car drives, but I think the consensus is, for a fix to be viable, it has to be in the software.

[BigWhite]

Anyone tried resetting the computer by disconnecting the battery overnight to see if it helps at all ? I was at dealer for unrelated issue and overheard another Pilot owner being suggested by the SA to leave the vehicle overnight so the dealer will attempt resetting the computer ! I was shocked but figured anything could be worth a try right ?




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[rocky]

Originally Posted by Underdog

That said it's interesting that the OP has not contributed to this thread since his "Rant". Dare I say it seems the troll has been fed.

Agreed. Sadly though the mods don't seem to lock out trolls or their threads.




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[Bruce K]

[QUOTE=Tmuchacho;412963]Gents, it is quite funny what the OP has created here. The title of his original post was obnoxious, and that really isn't the proper way to get your point across. There are so many things I do like about this vehicle, despite its shortcomings. I just got home and experienced the highest MPG I've ever seen since I bought the car (now 32K). Was on fumes and filled her up, drove the remaining 40 miles to home and the display read 27.9. Now this is flat roads in the low country, 40-50 MPH and cruise control for most of the trip (last 3-4 miles locked in the cruise at 35MPH). So there's no question the VCM does what it's suppose to, it's just what you have to put up with during the process.

I bought my Pilot a couple days before Thanksgiving. On Thanksgiving, we drove it approx. 250 miles to my sister's brother house and back. I calculated about 26.5 MPG and the computer about 26. The VCM does work, and to date have not felt the shudder or the stutter (knock on wood).

Semper Gumby

[HoustonBruce]

Originally Posted by Tim Jim

Also, even feather footing it at sustained 60 MPH I can't seem to get better than 22.5 MPG. Yeah, yeah, I know it's not broken in yet, but I should be able to get the sticker's 24 hwy under SOME circumstances.

Fuel mileage was one of my concerns with my purchase but so far I am ecstatic with my '13 2-WD EX-L. The fuel economy on the current tank (392 miles in) is an amazing 29.1 mpg. Now I will admit that this is mostly highway driving and I am not pushing it, but the best my '09 Pilot would have achieved is about 24 under the same conditions.

[Filipilot]

Originally Posted by Tmuchacho

Ok, found that Odyssey site - Honda Odyssey Forum : Odyssey Minivan Forums. In the search box, key in VCM long term reliability, only if you're interested or curious. There are 4 or 5 pages of posts, some relating to the earlier oil consumption issue. As it turned out, somebody tried the fellows idea of removing the oil sensors and plugging them but it didn't work. There are some engine pictures there from people that have disconnected the wires and are happy as I was with the way the car drives, but I think the consensus is, for a fix to be viable, it has to be in the software.

Thanks for the link Tmuchacho, I agree with you that unplugging OPS is just a temporary fix (or might not even work for everybody) same as driving it on D3 in the city but so far there is no software fix or update for this shudder issues. Also while I was reading the odyssey posts,some also mentioned T.C. going bad causing shudder and when replaced it fixed their problem. What is the the possibility that my 2012 with 2870 miles has a defective T.C. already? shudder only happens when T.C. is on final gear lock up and on VCM 3 cylinders of course.(mostly 30 - 40 MPH and coasting on freeways)

[Armystrong]

I mentioned this before with no comments from anyone.

To me it does appear to be a characteristic of the Pilot. Here is why. When VCM kicks in an you are operating at 3/4 cyclinders the Pilot is obviously in an economical mode, not requiring a lot of power for the driving condition. Most are having issues with a slight shudder from the transition from VCM to a state of needing additional power (more cylinders). Is it hard to believe there is going to be a transition from 3 cylinders pushing a 6k pound vehicle to 6 cylinders? Many should notice this slight transition but it may bother some more than others.

I say many because if you use cruise control for several miles then all of a sudden want to moderately increase power to pass someone you will feel the transition from VCM to more power requirement. I'm not talking about flooring it or abruptly accelerating but what happens when you pull a 2000 pd trailer with a 4 cylinder engine....it shudders until you eventually get momentum. Try flooring it and it wont move out. But when you drop the trailer it has the necessary power to move out without shuddering.

How do you expect the engine to go from VCM mode to 6 cylinders without a transition?

[Tmuchacho]

Houston Bruce, my 2011 Pilot really began to show improvement in fuel economy between 20 & 25K as surprising as it sounds. When I first entered this site when I purchased the car, I saw a couple of other posts mentioning similar break in and I found it hard to believe. I think these engines do take that long to loosen up, so be patient.

[HenryBravo]

Originally Posted by Armystrong

I mentioned this before with no comments from anyone.

To me it does appear to be a characteristic of the Pilot. Here is why. When VCM kicks in an you are operating at 3/4 cyclinders the Pilot is obviously in an economical mode, not requiring a lot of power for the driving condition. Most are having issues with a slight shudder from the transition from VCM to a state of needing additional power (more cylinders). Is it hard to believe there is going to be a transition from 3 cylinders pushing a 6k pound vehicle to 6 cylinders? Many should notice this slight transition but it may bother some more than others.

I say many because if you use cruise control for several miles then all of a sudden want to moderately increase power to pass someone you will feel the transition from VCM to more power requirement. I'm not talking about flooring it or abruptly accelerating but what happens when you pull a 2000 pd trailer with a 4 cylinder engine....it shudders until you eventually get momentum. Try flooring it and it wont move out. But when you drop the trailer it has the necessary power to move out without shuddering.

How do you expect the engine to go from VCM mode to 6 cylinders without a transition?

Yes I think everyone understands this. The thing is, based on some of the comments I've been reading, it's quite a doozy of a "transition" that vibrates the vehicle, and this problem doesn't happen on all Pilots. My '10 didn't shudder and my '12 doesn't either. I'm a very picky person about my vehicles and I would notice this. I hear sounds and feel things in cars that a lot of other people don't. The bottom line is the Active Control Engine Mount (ACM) system is supposed to counteract the vibration so the occupants don't notice the transition. Since this shuddering problem is not universal, it does make one wonder if it could be fixed somehow on the vehicles having the problem.

If Honda can't produce a consistent and complete line of Pilots that are shudder free, then they should either:

• educate the owner (in the Owner's Manual for example) to set their expectation that there may be a noticeable shudder/vibration and that's just the way it is
• give the driver an option to turn VCM on and off. There are plenty of other vehicles with "ECO" or "Economy" buttons to enable/disable various fuel saving features (this article lists such vehicles as of 2011)
• abandon the feature entirely (unlikely since I'm presuming that Honda strives for every MPG possible)
• really double down their efforts and get this problem fixed once and for all in future models (and hopefully issue a TSB for existing owners)

[EmptyTank]

Excellent post, HenryBravo!

[Yahooligan]

I can actually cause shudder on-demand with our Pilot, it's not something we experience all the time and actually only happens at a certain speed.

If I set the cruise at exactly 65mph on level ground that seems to be the "sweet spot" for VCM shudder while cruising. It's not horrible, but there is a low-frequency vibration/hum at that speed and RPM. Our speed limits around here are either below or above 65mph so it's not often that we end up cruising at 65 and it's not something my wife has complained about or even claimed to notice. If she doesn't care then I'm not going to care, it's her car and she loves it.

It would be nice if they gave the option to disable VCM, but I don't see that happening as doing so would impact their EPA/CAFE numbers.

[Filipilot]

Originally Posted by Yahooligan

I can actually cause shudder on-demand with our Pilot, it's not something we experience all the time and actually only happens at a certain speed.

If I set the cruise at exactly 65mph on level ground that seems to be the "sweet spot" for VCM shudder while cruising. It's not horrible, but there is a low-frequency vibration/hum at that speed and RPM. Our speed limits around here are either below or above 65mph so it's not often that we end up cruising at 65 and it's not something my wife has complained about or even claimed to notice. If she doesn't care then I'm not going to care, it's her car and she loves it.

It would be nice if they gave the option to disable VCM, but I don't see that happening as doing so would impact their EPA/CAFE numbers.

My shudder on-demand is at 30-35-40 MPH city driving, freeway light throttle( coasting) and cruise control at speed like yours and after driving at high speed on the freeway going to local roads at 40-45 trying to stay at speed limit.(let the shudder begin) it bugs me a lot. VCM on/off switch is yet to be invented I guess.

[Chasmoore]

Maybe it's the severe low temps here lately (sub-zero) that are causing an increase in how noticeable the vibration/rumble is on my 2012 EX-L. I have 5K miles on the car and other than the VCM/ECO rumble, I like it a lot. Mine really vibrates and groans at 1500 RPM going about 30 MPH. It almost feels like I'm driving a standard in too high a gear, like I need to downshift. They used to call it lugging the engine.

I didn't detect this when I test drove the car on a hot August day but did notice the issue very soon after delivery. Reading these boards led me to the conclusion that this is an expected characteristic of the later model Pilots, a fact that would have steered me to something else had I known beforehand. My 03 with 150K miles ran much smoother, which is quite a disappointment. I will bring this up with my dealer at my first oil change and see what fix, if any, is in the works. I have to believe that Honda is working on correcting this significant flaw - I hope so anyway.