2010 Oil Consumption Problem

[xGS]

Originally Posted by Yahooligan

I don't live my life by hypotheticals, however if Honda did actually, eventually, push such intervals then I would follow them but only if I used the proper parts/oil.

Countless people are following the longer intervals and have no problem getting well over 100,000 miles and have no oil consumption problems. Some have even torn into their engines after 100,000+ miles using synthetic oil and the longer manufacturer intervals to find the internals clean as a whistle and crosshatch still on the cylinder walls.

If you or anyone else has documented proof of this then by all means, post it up. I think it would be a good read. So far, all I see is talk. People making assumptions that this and that recommended by the mfr is going to cause premature engine failure/wear. If this were actually happening then we wouldn't be having this discussion as there would be numerous reports of engine failures or rebuilds due to worn bearings, rings, or cylinder walls.

Instead, all I hear is how so many vehicles have made it well over 100,000 miles without any problems all while following the mfr's maintenance schedule.

You keep evading the question - why?

I gave you a non-hypothetical example of an owner on schedule to an OCI >10k miles on the factory fill of semi-synthetic 0W-20 oil and the standard Honda/Fram filter.

What do you consider "proper parts/oil?"
Something other than a semi-synthetic 0W-20 and the standard Honda/Fram oil filter?

Recall that while Honda specifies that "conventional" oil is sufficient, you have to get at least a semi-synthetic formula to find the 0W-20 grade.
Keep in mind, too, that Honda specifies oil filter changes only at every other oil change.

For a "good read", start here and the links therein: Best oil for Honda VCM 3.5L - Bob Is The Oil Guy

Also, the issue isn't necessarily engine wear, but oil sludging, PCV valves clogging and oil filters possibly going into bypass mode.

[Wisconsin]

I'll answer the question....

>10k on factory fill. No.
>20k on a Fram filter (every other oil change like Honda recommends). HELL NO!

I go until the MM signals a change is needed at 15% or whatever it is (usually around 8-10k miles for me).
But I also use Redline oil & Royal Purple filter.

[Yahooligan]

Originally Posted by xGS

You keep evading the question - why?

Perhaps you need glasses, I answered the question.

I gave you a non-hypothetical example of an owner on schedule to an OCI >10k miles on the factory fill of semi-synthetic 0W-20 oil and the standard Honda/Fram filter.

Can you name anyone that's had their Pilot have them go > 10k miles before the MM prompted for maintenance? If you can't then guess what, you just came up with a hypothetical question.

What do you consider "proper parts/oil?"
Something other than a semi-synthetic 0W-20 and the standard Honda/Fram oil filter?

Really, I think you do need glasses as I covered that in my reply as well. The proper parts are those the mfr specs. You're more than welcome to use parts that exceed those specs, but anyone that uses parts that don't meet spec has no room to complain if they have issues. The mfr and engineers specify requirements/recommendations for a reason and it's not just because they have to meet CAFE numbers (They actually DON'T have to meet CAFE numbers, the "fine" for being below CAFE requirements for a given vehicle class is laughable).

Recall that while Honda specifies that "conventional" oil is sufficient, you have to get at least a semi-synthetic formula to find the 0W-20 grade.
Keep in mind, too, that Honda specifies oil filter changes only at every other oil change.

If the oil filters have sufficient capacity to go that long, great. Oil filters don't wear out, they fill up. Personally, I'd prefer if they were changed every time, and so far as of the single oil change we've had done at the dealer so far, they do replace the filter every change.

For a "good read", start here and the links therein: Best oil for Honda VCM 3.5L - Bob Is The Oil Guy

Also, the issue isn't necessarily engine wear, but oil sludging, PCV valves clogging and oil filters possibly going into bypass mode.

Sludge is often the result of using conventional oil with OCIs that are too long, such as I mentioned in my last reply where, hypothetically, some people don't follow the mfr oil recommendations and use conventional oil but follow OCIs meant for synthetics or blends. That is not the fault of the mfr.

PCV valves are a maintenance item and the kind of oil and OCI doesn't impact them, other than due to what I just said up above.

Oil filters going into bypass actually do impact engine wear...

So, again, do you have any documented proof or evidence that following mfr recommendations and OCIs has a negative impact on longevity? Seems you're trying to make an argument against doing what the mfr says when you don't have any actual reason to make the argument other than you don't agree with the engineers. You have a solution that's looking for a problem, not the other way around.

At the end of the day, people are going to do what they feel is right or they're going to do whatever's cheapest. It's not hard to figure out which group is more likely to have problems in general.

[Jackate]

Personally for peace of mind, I switched to synthetic. I know that subject has been beat to death, that not my point! My point is if you use "Fully" Synthetic oil you reduce the chance of developing sludge which is a common problem with newer designed engines that can cause engine failure.

If I was using Dino oil I would be changing every 3 to 4 thousand. Not worth the risk for me. Just my point of view. I Personally would not trust any DINO over 5000 MAX, I don't care what the manufacture says.

How to Reduce Oil Sludge | eHow.com

[whizmo]

Originally Posted by Jackate

That is not excessive it is insane!! If you a burning that much oil you should be leaving a blue smoke screen behind you.

This is simply not true.

A 1-qt/2K miles consumption rate results in the burning of about a teaspoon of oil every 10 miles. This rate would be totally invisible. It takes consumption rates of a qt every few hundred miles or more before the exhaust will take on any unusual appearance and a rate of less than a hundred miles before it will be easily noticeable.

Oil burning at the afore-mentioned rate is an annoyance and expense, but nothing more, nothing less.

- Mark

[xGS]

Originally Posted by Yahooligan

Can you name anyone that's had their Pilot have them go > 10k miles before the MM prompted for maintenance? If you can't then guess what, you just came up with a hypothetical question.

And here we go, again: Why is my Pilot engine failing after only 90K miles?

Originally Posted by Yahooligan

If the oil filters have sufficient capacity to go that long, great. Oil filters don't wear out, they fill up.

How would you ever know that the filter is full?

Originally Posted by Yahooligan

PCV valves are a maintenance item...

On which page of the owner's manual is that indicated?

[Strate L O S S]

check the filter dipstick

your pilot doesn't have ?


Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

[Yahooligan]

Originally Posted by xGS

And here we go, again: Why is my Pilot engine failing after only 90K miles?

Surprise, not using synthetic (And, apparently, Honda didn't call for 0w20 in 2009). Based on the oil recommendations at the time and the MM intervals it sure sounds like they have (had) a case against Honda. If Honda told me to run conventional for 9000-10000 miles I wouldn't do it, and they don't seem to be recommending it at this point, nor did I say previously that I would do it with conventional oil. We have a 2012, which seems to have different oil requirements than 2009, so based on OUR Pilot and the CURRENT mfr specs I have no problem following what Honda says. Sucks that someone had a problem, but one issue does not make the rule. Do you have any other examples? Or is one out of the tens or hundreds of thousands of vehicles supposed to prove something even though it's statistically insignificant?

Man, I wish I could use a single, freak incident as proof in my line of work. It would make things so much easier.

How would you ever know that the filter is full?

How do you ever know anything? Better go out and change my oil filter now with only 1,000 miles on it, OMG! Do you think engineers just pull numbers out of their butt?

On which page of the owner's manual is that indicated?

Boy, I wish maintaining vehicles were as simple as Honda makes it out to be in their maintenance section. Why isn't it listed? I don't know. Doesn't change the fact that it is a maintenance item and is user-replaceable for all of $2.50.

Do what you want, this topic has become rather droll.

Have a nice weekend.

[Strate L O S S]

Honda doesn't specify synthetic or a blend as a required oil.

Just 0w20.

And on that note the 2009 engine and the 2012 engine are identical. As is the MMI calculations. All the same.




Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

[Yahooligan]

Originally Posted by Strate L O S S

Honda doesn't specify synthetic or a blend as a required oil.

Just 0w20.

And on that note the 2009 engine and the 2012 engine are identical. As is the MMI calculations. All the same.




Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

Can you find a 0w20 that's not synthetic or a blend?

Sent from my SCH-I535 using AutoGuide.Com Free App

[Strate L O S S]

only place I look at oil is Walmart and they don't have it currently.

to clarify I don't believe there is non blend on the market yet but it's only a matter of time until there will be.

back in 07 when I got my first Honda (08 Civic) 5w20 was hard to come by, now it's abundant. 0w20 will soon follow.

so would you go 10k miles on conventional 0w20 and 20k miles on the made by fram Honda filter? that was the question and I think you answered.




Sent from AutoGuide.com Free App

[Jackate]

Use synthetic oil and find how many miles the manufacture says it's good for and stay way under that amount. If they say 15,000 miles run it for 9,000 as a example.(make up your own number).
USE NAPA GOLD oil filter 1356 - It is made by Wix or use the WIX equivalent (Top Shelf Filter)
Buy this - To keep you oil level in the cross hatches of your dip stick.
Hopkins/Measu-funnel (10704) | Funnel | AutoZone.com take off the black tip on the end before filling it just gets in the way. This is a nice funnel and has a twist on/off filling valve, and you can measure the amount you are putting in.

Then you have done all you can do regarding oil, and forget about it..