Oil Pump and Timing Belt

[cagi26]

Hi all - I'll announce that I'm a gal who has no clue on most things auto... so I'm going to need A LOT of help here.

2004 Pilot ex 114,000 miles. At near 90K we took it (I know I know - to the dealership) for the timing belt. At that time they said there was oil leak. As they replaced to the timing belt, the claim was that the oil leak was relative to the timing belt tensioner. I paid the additional money to have that part replaced. Fast forward to now where it was time for a major service and they tell me that there is an oil leak. This time it's the o-ring on the oil pump.

Am I crazy - or did they have to hold the oil pump in their hands while they replaced the timing belt? Wouldn't they look it over before putting it back together?

I'm feeling like i'm totally getting hosed on this.

Thoughts? I'd really appreciate your advice.

[rocky]

There is a hose out.

The tensioner would not contribute to the oil leak.

How much oil is being lost. Can you see where the oil is coming from?

[ptsmh73]

Dear cagi26 - Not sure if this will help, but here goes. The part that is most associated with the timing belt replacement is the water pump. It (water pump) runs off the same belt (timing belt) so many people replace the water pump when they have the timing belt replaced. Looking at some diagrams, the oil pump is at the bottom of the section where the timing belt cover is attached (i.e., near the crankshaft). It appears the oil pump may also run on the timing belt as well. Therefore, the oil leak could very well be an o-ring at the oil pump. The "bad news" is, it looks like they'll have to take ALL these parts out again in order to replace the defective o-ring. Big labor hours and $$$. As Rocky asked, "How bad is the leak?" Is it worth fixing at the projected cost? Part Detail)

[mudbog]

You don't have to remove the oil pump to replace the timing belt. I just recently did the timing belt on my '04 Pilot. Like ptsmh73 noted, however, you typically replace the water pump. And while all the parts are removed to get to the timing belt, the 2 timing belt idlers and the tensionor are also typically replaced. It's cheap insurance in case the old parts are near the end of their life. Finally, I also replaced my spark plugs at the same time since I had to pull them out so it was easier to align cylinder 1 at TDC when doing the timing belt change.

It is possible that the oil pump was not leaking when the dealership did the timing belt. Or maybe they just didn't notice it then.

[ptsmh73]

Originally Posted by mudbog

You don't have to remove the oil pump to replace the timing belt. I just recently did the timing belt on my '04 Pilot. Like ptsmh73 noted, however, you typically replace the water pump. And while all the parts are removed to get to the timing belt, the 2 timing belt idlers and the tensionor are also typically replaced. It's cheap insurance in case the old parts are near the end of their life. Finally, I also replaced my spark plugs at the same time since I had to pull them out so it was easier to align cylinder 1 at TDC when doing the timing belt change.

It is possible that the oil pump was not leaking when the dealership did the timing belt. Or maybe they just didn't notice it then.

mudbog - I don't think anyone has stated or implied that you NEED to remove the oil pump when replacing the timimg belt. The original poster (OP) reported that when she had her TB replaced the dealership told her there was an oil leak, which they reported to have fixed by replacing one of the tensioners. Now, they are telling her the oil leak is due to a bad o-ring behind the oil pump, so it apparently was not fixed during the TB job (or maybe as you noted is a new leak - who knows?). Now, it looks like to replace the o-ring they have to repeat all the ripout labor they recently did during the TB job. Its frustrating, regardless.

[94eg!]

Originally Posted by cagi26

Hi all - I'll announce that I'm a gal who has no clue on most things auto... so I'm going to need A LOT of help here.

2004 Pilot ex 114,000 miles. At near 90K we took it (I know I know - to the dealership) for the timing belt. At that time they said there was oil leak. As they replaced to the timing belt, the claim was that the oil leak was relative to the timing belt tensioner. I paid the additional money to have that part replaced. Fast forward to now where it was time for a major service and they tell me that there is an oil leak. This time it's the o-ring on the oil pump.

Am I crazy - or did they have to hold the oil pump in their hands while they replaced the timing belt? Wouldn't they look it over before putting it back together?

I'm feeling like i'm totally getting hosed on this.

Thoughts? I'd really appreciate your advice.

Well it sounds like the original oil leak was comming from the hydraulic tensioner for the timing belt. This part is a separate piece from the motor and simply bolts on. It's about the size of a small cell phone. It is common for them to leak and they should definitely NOT be reused as they will allow the belt to go slack if they loose too much oil:



They were definitely in the area of the oil pump when they did the timing belt, so any leak at that time would have been noticed. The oil pump itself is not removed during the work as it's basically the entire front section of the motor. The area only gets broken down to the point I'm showing you below. And as you can see, any oil dripping down from behind those cogs would be quite obvious. The oil pump seal (not o-ring) is behind the lowest cog in these pictures. The seal itself is not difficult to change, but they do have to remove the timing belt to get to it. I would say that if the leak isn't bad enough to drip, then perhaps live with it until it gets worse. Once it does get worse, call back and start pricing the job. They will give you different prices at different times of the month depending on how busy they are. Just wait for the price to go down.

[mudbog]

Originally Posted by ptsmh73

mudbog - I don't think anyone has stated or implied that you NEED to remove the oil pump when replacing the timimg belt. The original poster (OP) reported that when she had her TB replaced the dealership told her there was an oil leak, which they reported to have fixed by replacing one of the tensioners. Now, they are telling her the oil leak is due to a bad o-ring behind the oil pump, so it apparently was not fixed during the TB job (or maybe as you noted is a new leak - who knows?). Now, it looks like to replace the o-ring they have to repeat all the ripout labor they recently did during the TB job. Its frustrating, regardless.

Yep. I was just answering the OP's question ("Am I crazy - or did they have to hold the oil pump in their hands while they replaced the timing belt?") i don't think the oil leak will be pinpointed until the dealer removes the timing cover, belt, etc. and has a look at the suspect area.