Pilot performance

[Scancord]

Anyone know if there is a cold air intake for the Pilot

Are there any struts outside of the Honda and KYB made for the Pilot

[A6Pilot]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Scancord
[B]Anyone know if there is a cold air intake for the Pilot

The Pilot already comes from the factory with a cold air intake that actually works.

[tunergirl]

Originally posted by Scancord
Anyone know if there is a cold air intake for the Pilot

Are there any struts outside of the Honda and KYB made for the Pilot

My husband and I fabricated and "aftermarket" CAI for the Pilot. Here's a pic





No other struts made for the Pilot except waht you have mentioned.

[N_Jay]

Now you need to make a piece that fits around it to keep it from getting any engine compartment (warmed) air.

My guess is on most cars these do nothing. You long strait run probably gives you a HP bump at high RPM, but probably losses you some HP across the normal driving range.

[tunergirl]

Originally posted by N_Jay
Now you need to make a piece that fits around it to keep it from getting any engine compartment (warmed) air.

My guess is on most cars these do nothing. You long strait run probably gives you a HP bump at high RPM, but probably losses you some HP across the normal driving range.

I have noticed the difference already. It now has a low growl to him and he can breathe much better. He doesn't get bogged down in the lower RPM's at all. IMO he runs much better all the way around with the CAI on.

We have a few upgrades coming to the pilot just need the funds to start them. WE are doing a custom dual exhaust, aftermarket tranny cooler, projector headlights are being made now and a few others.

[A6Pilot]

Originally posted by tunergirl


I have noticed the difference already. It now has a low growl to him and he can breathe much better. He doesn't get bogged down in the lower RPM's at all. IMO he runs much better all the way around with the CAI on.

My bet is you have actually lost a bit of power with that intake setup. It may look cool, and sound louder, but you have actually defeated a couple of features the Honda powertrain engineers designed into the intake.

First, you are pulling heated air from the engine compartment into the engine. Heated air is less dense, therefore less power. Clearly you are not running a CAI. Anything but!

Second, the Honda engineers actually shaped the intake ducting to mildly amplify intake pressure waves. Take a close look at the pieces you took off the intake system. Notice that the length is carefully calibrated, and that it was designed with some odd looking horns that are precisely sculpted to capture these pressure waves. Substitute a long straight pipe, and you defeat some pretty amazing engineering.

But it does look cool!

BTW-
How much did you invest in that shiny pipe?

[tunergirl]

Originally posted by A6Pilot


My bet is you have actually lost a bit of power with that intake setup. It may look cool, and sound louder, but you have actually defeated a couple of features the Honda powertrain engineers designed into the intake.

First, you are pulling heated air from the engine compartment into the engine. Heated air is less dense, therefore less power. Clearly you are not running a CAI. Anything but!

Second, the Honda engineers actually shaped the intake ducting to mildly amplify intake pressure waves. Take a close look at the pieces you took off the intake system. Notice that the length is carefully calibrated, and that it was designed with some odd looking horns that are precisely sculpted to capture these pressure waves. Substitute a long straight pipe, and you defeat some pretty amazing engineering.

But it does look cool!

BTW-
How much did you invest in that shiny pipe?

First, it's not a straight pipe it has a bend in it. It is in comparison to the AEM ones that are made for all other vehicles and it does the same. We are not completel done with it. Also I have NOT noticed any power loss at all. In fact his pick up and go is a lot better now since He can breathe better.

Second, My husband is an engineer and if he didn't think it would do any good he wouldn't have put it on there. Hence, see #1 about the AEM ones. This one and the AEM ones are very close to the same size. WE have the AEM one in our Accord as well as a lot of friends have the same thing in their vehicles.

BTW- We got a box (kit) full of different size bends and straights for different projects this being one of them. I don't know what the cost was off the top of my head just for htose pieces.

[jarizzo]

The Pilot's stock air intake is an excellent piece of engineering, as has already been suggested. There is no way in #ell that Honda would let a $25 piece of molded plastic (the intake hose and air box) hold back the performance of a sophisticated and precision manufactured piece of equipment like the 3.5L V-6 engine. It doesn't make any sense at all from a financial perspective (the only one that counts) for them not to include something like this 90 degree bent piece of aluminum pipe if it would improve performance or anything else. They didn't put it in there because it doesn't help anything but it makes more noise. I challenge anyone with a CAI on a Pilot to prove definitively measurable performance improvements in normal daily driving (not racing) that will offset the risks. Apples to apples comparisons and real world numbers. I'm not going to hold my breath.

If your engineer husband has this all figured out, then what was the intended benefit? Air temperature? Air flow? Certainly he's measured the temperature and volume of intake air before and after this modification was done. The sensors and engine computer do the measuring for you. Let's see some numbers. AutoTap will probably be able to give a graph the numbers from the IAT and manifold pressure or MAF sensors while you're driving. www.autotap.com

Butt dynos are psychosomatic, especially if the financial and emotional investments are high, as in your case. Save your money and put it in a Roth IRA or another investment that's more likely to perform under real world conditions.

Cheers!

John

[archie]

The Pilot's stock air intake is an excellent piece of engineering, as has already been suggested. There is no way in #ell that Honda would let a $25 piece of molded plastic (the intake hose and air box) hold back the performance of a sophisticated and precision manufactured piece of equipment like the 3.5L V-6 engine.

Any dyno charts to back this up? Any facts?

It doesn't make any sense at all from a financial perspective (the only one that counts) ...

Financial perspective is the only one that counts? If so, performance is secondary to financial perspective. Financial perspective (cost) could hold back performance. Every car has compromises.

[ctobio]

I'm an engineer too, and I think these so-called CAIs are utter cack.

This one, while looking cool and sounding cool, has the following things against it:

1. Any benefit from so-called "freer breathing" is as a result of the K & N cone filter you have. Problem with K & N filters is that it is utterly impossible to filter better and allow more air through. The cost you pay for increased airflow is increased ingestion of dirt. Keep an eye on your silicate contamination in your oil. Honestly, you could have saved yourself a bit of money and just gotten a drop-in K & N to achieve the same results.

2. It's NOT PULLING IN COLD AIR, as has been pointed out. Unless you can effectively shield the area where the CAI is pulling from, you're going to be pulling warm air. Warm air will not only lower performance, but it will also increase oil and coolant temps, which don't do the engine any favors.

3. You run an increased chance of ingesting water through the piping, and hydrolocking. Honda issued a service bulletin about this, seeing how popular this sort of thing is among the tuner set.

4. I challenge you to prove that this produces an actual benefit beyond the butt-dyno. We know what the Pilot can deliver with the OEM bits. You want to sell someone on your concept, you need to prove it.

[jarizzo]

Originally posted by archie
Any dyno charts to back this up? Any facts? Financial perspective is the only one that counts? If so, performance is secondary to financial perspective. Financial perspective has in the past held back performance in various situation. Every car has compromises.

If only the world was that black and white. Every car does have compromises, but the Pilot has a lot of worthy competitors, and the financial perspective is that it doesn't make any sense to let a $25 or less plastic part hold back the HP and torque numbers and the real-world test-drive performance of the Pilot when so many others are waiting to take its place. When American car companies were the only game in town, the only choice you had was crappy engineering. Competition has brought vast improvements to automotive technology, involving billions of dollars in research and development and testing. But in the minds of some, an air hose and filter are still somehow beyond the reach of such improvements. Likely? I don't think so.

Still waiting for some numbers archie. I'm the defendant here. You have to prove me wrong. Don't let your anger distract you from providing the proof. It shouldn't be that hard to do with an OBD-II scan tool and software and a dynamometer. Hell, since tunergirl and her engineer husband have it figured out, they should sell that hose and filter to Honda. Then they could buy the fuel line magnets and the Tornado too. Their Pilot would be racing at Indy and they'd have to drain the gas out of the tank once a week because the mileage would be so good. I think there is as much chance that aluminum tube and gauze filter are improving anything except for profits at aluminum tubing companies and K&N.

Cheers!

John

[rlapid]

opinions are like belly buttons

[N_Jay]

Originally posted by ctobio
I'm an engineer too, and I think these so-called CAIs are utter cack.

I agree!

And I am an engineer too.

Well, not really, they made me turn my BSEE degree in when I got my MBA.

You know, its against the rules to use any engineering knowledge in "management"! (Just ask Dilbert!)

[tunergirl]

Originally posted by jarizzo
The Pilot's stock air intake is an excellent piece of engineering, as has already been suggested. There is no way in #ell that Honda would let a $25 piece of molded plastic (the intake hose and air box) hold back the performance of a sophisticated and precision manufactured piece of equipment like the 3.5L V-6 engine. It doesn't make any sense at all from a financial perspective (the only one that counts) for them not to include something like this 90 degree bent piece of aluminum pipe if it would improve performance or anything else. They didn't put it in there because it doesn't help anything but it makes more noise. I challenge anyone with a CAI on a Pilot to prove definitively measurable performance improvements in normal daily driving (not racing) that will offset the risks. Apples to apples comparisons and real world numbers. I'm not going to hold my breath.

If your engineer husband has this all figured out, then what was the intended benefit? Air temperature? Air flow? Certainly he's measured the temperature and volume of intake air before and after this modification was done. The sensors and engine computer do the measuring for you. Let's see some numbers. AutoTap will probably be able to give a graph the numbers from the IAT and manifold pressure or MAF sensors while you're driving. www.autotap.com

Butt dynos are psychosomatic, especially if the financial and emotional investments are high, as in your case. Save your money and put it in a Roth IRA or another investment that's more likely to perform under real world conditions.

Cheers!

John

First of all, please don't take offense to this but if people want to spend their money on their vehicles that should be their desicion. Also you have no clue how we are financially with IRA or anything else. So don't assume that I have no investments.

As for the CAI, with our ACCORDS and some others that have done this it actually gains about 10-12 HP. This has been proven on other forum sites as well as on our vehicle. The stock cold air intake box in the pilots from the manuafacturer is to reduce NOISE. The aftermarket CAI does the same and wors the same except it maes it louder becuase of no box. If you were to see the Pilot in person the filter is where it's supposed to be in regards to pulling col air in from behind the headlight and through the bottom. If we lowered the filter down into the hole it would pull up rain and debri and such and do more damage.

[tunergirl]

Originally posted by ctobio
I'm an engineer too, and I think these so-called CAIs are utter cack.

This one, while looking cool and sounding cool, has the following things against it:

1. Any benefit from so-called "freer breathing" is as a result of the K & N cone filter you have. Problem with K & N filters is that it is utterly impossible to filter better and allow more air through. The cost you pay for increased airflow is increased ingestion of dirt. Keep an eye on your silicate contamination in your oil. Honestly, you could have saved yourself a bit of money and just gotten a drop-in K & N to achieve the same results.

2. It's NOT PULLING IN COLD AIR, as has been pointed out. Unless you can effectively shield the area where the CAI is pulling from, you're going to be pulling warm air. Warm air will not only lower performance, but it will also increase oil and coolant temps, which don't do the engine any favors.

3. You run an increased chance of ingesting water through the piping, and hydrolocking. Honda issued a service bulletin about this, seeing how popular this sort of thing is among the tuner set.

4. I challenge you to prove that this produces an actual benefit beyond the butt-dyno. We know what the Pilot can deliver with the OEM bits. You want to sell someone on your concept, you need to prove it.

I was just answering a question from someone else.

OH BY THE WAY, I AM ONE OF THOSE TUNER PEOPLE that you mention in #3.

Have you worked on J-series engines for over 20 years of your life to really know what you are talking about? My husband has and used to be certified in another state until moving to VA 2 years ago.