Explorer Comparisons??

[GM Convert??]

I have been looking through the various forums and have seen very little references to Explorer, especailly '03 or '04 (a few about 2002 or earlier models). I am in the home stretch (probably < 1 week) of research before buying (getting rid of our '96 Blazer, which BTW had treated us fairly well until the past year) and we're down to just the Pilot EX and Explorer XLT 4x4. They compare well in crash tests, ride quality and dimensions (int. & ext.). There are some features on each that we'd like to see on the other, but the biggies that lean us (more my wife than me) towards the Explorer are:

- poor seat comfort - wife's quote "rear seats are like those of a school bus" flat, stiff boards. And the cool activity center in center 2nd row is extremely uncomfortable if someone has to sit at that position.

- no rear glass opening - this is something we took for granted would be on all SUV's. Probably 8 outta 10 times we access the back of our Blazer is thru the glass.

- 3rd row access - while Honda improved this by sliding the 2nd row, the Explorer's "flip & tumble" is much easier and provides larger opening to climb in. With 2 kids in early elementary school, we anticipate increasing usage as they take friends places or mom provides Taxi service

- no sunroof - wife really wants one - this will be her daily driver...

And, obviously, an Explorer can be had for about $2k less, not even factoring in that we'd have to pay extra to get roof rack, running boards & sunroof (all incl. in Explorer price). Yes, I understand about future resale values & reliability concerns, but it's hard to argue with the wife's basic logic: cost/performance data isn't going to make any daily annoyances/omissions in usability or comfort feel any better"

Any input, even slightly "skewed", would be helpful. Thanks!

[PQSpin]

Those were the 2 vehicles I compared before going with the Pilot. The only 2 things I liked better on the Explorer were the privacy glass and towing capacity (We have nothing to tow anyway).
We bought the Pilot LX (compared to the Explorer XLS). Our best price from a Ford dealer was about a $1000 less. I'll probably save that in gas mileage alone in the years to come. Not to mention that my brother-in-law's 2000 Explorer has cost him over $3000 in repairs.

[a2Pilot]

IMO, the all wheel drive system in the Pilot is FAR better than the Explorer for daily driving. (I had a 95 Explorer XLT years ago)

The Explorer is rear wheel drive until you flip the switch on the dash. The Pilot is front wheel drive until the computer senses need for the rear wheels, and feeds them power.

I recall an event with my Explorer that remains etched in my mind. I had just run it through a car wash, and was waiting to make a left turn onto a very busy five lane street. A small opening appeared, so I floored it to get out of there. I made it across the first two lanes of traffic when both rear tires broke loose and the rear end began to fish-tail around. Startled, I let off the gas, but I had already gone around nearly 180 degrees. This was a total surprise since the 4.0 V6 was under-powered, and I had the "Limited Slip" rear axle. The pavement was dry, but my tires were wet. Ever since then, I always turned on the four wheel drive when pulling into traffic with wet tires or road. My Explorer was unpredictable without doing that first.

I've pulled out of that very same car wash with my Pilot, and NEVER had any wheel spin! I always feel in complete control in the Pilot. But I also wish it had a sunroof!!!

Happy Shopping!

[Sunday Rider]

My previous SUV was the 2000 Explorer XLT. So cannot help you on the newer "improved" Explorer version. I considered the 2003 Explorer, and have to agree with missing the sunroof. But I liked the roomier feeling in the Pilot, the reliability. I am not concerned about the resale value (yet). I keep a car for a long time.

We rented an 02 Explorer when we were out in Whistler B.C. and found it very nice, drove like a car, but mushy ride.

For some reason I don't miss the sunroof, will see in the summer.

I have had 3 Explorers, since they came out. The first one I put 300,00 km (180,000 mi) with only a couple of brake jobs. It was the best Explorer I had. The other 2 I leased, with the intention of buying them at the end, but they had so many rattles. The 2000 was starting to act odd with the transmission, lights coming on, and off, and tough shifts, but then all went away, hmmm.

Sorry for the long reply.
If your wife is going to drive it, you better let her decide, for you will never, never, hear the end of it.

Not sure if there is an Explorer forum. I bet it will not be as much fun as the HP forum.....
Good luck

[robrecht]

Originally posted by GM Convert??
They compare well in crash tests ...

Sounds like your wife has identified some very pertinant points of comparison. But checking the 2003 NHTSA static rollover ratings, you'll note that many of the Explorers have 2-star rollover ratings.

http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/testing/nc.../2003SUVs.html

Seeing that, I'd check a little more on things like stability control systems, emergency avoidance maneuver testing by Consumer Reports, etc.

Good luck!

[a2Pilot]

+Honda Pilot
1. Honda Reliability
2. Fantastic Local Honda Dealer Sales Dept. (Go Howard Cooper Imports!!!)
3. Fantastic Local Honda Service that runs shuttles to my place of work.
4. Pilot based on winning platform of Ody/MDX
5. hondapilot.org - amazing resource for purchasing and owning a Pilot.
6. State-of-the-Art engine, drivetrain, AWD system
7. Pilot is an MDX-Lite. (Save 8K!)
8. Honda Reliability
9. Scheduled maintenance program to keep the Pilot running in tip-top shape for the life of the vehicle.
10. I ain't drivin' no stinkin' mini-van!!

-Ford Explorer
1. My last several Fords had constant major problems. (Head Gaskets / Transmission Seals / Fuel injectors / etc.)
2. Unsatisfactory local Ford Dealer Sales Depts. (Got a form letter from our former salesman a month after reading his obituary in the paper!)
3. Unsatisfactory local Ford Service that almost never finished the job on time and kept the truck for days and days and days......
4. REAMED them on the customer service surveys and nobody seemed to care.

(I can get "A Plan" pricing through a family member who works for Ford, but have finally decided the frustration is not worth the discount.) It's a shame...........

The sunroof in the Explorer is kinda small anyway...........

[GM Convert??]

Originally posted by Sunday Rider

If your wife is going to drive it, you better let her decide, for you will never, never, hear the end of it.

Amen to that!!
I've tried to provide all the research info I've found, trying to gently (oh, so gently ) push towards Pilot, but I can't argue her main 4 issues that I listed in original post, and the $$. Plus, not sure how long it would be til Pilot EX was actually available - dealer just had $1250 off "sale" that sold off his stock (and $1250 was factored in to our cost comparison - if he doesn't continue offer, price spread gets even larger)

Thanks to all who have replied so far!!

[PQSpin]

Regarding Ford customer service, it does stink!!!
My Mercury Villager went in for repair...
Thursday...no one looked at it.
Friday.....no one "qualified" to work on it. Only Oil & Lube guy working
Monday...Finally, someone looked at, couldn't find why van overheats. they know why owner overheats!!!
I asked 3 times to speak with a salesperson because it looks like the van is "history". Never received a callback.

Silko Honda in Raynham, MA has been the most courteous, polit and professional dealer that I have ever dealt with. If the Pilot is anything like the dealer, I won't have any problems! (They also gave me a reasonable discount off the list price.)

[ramirami]

my sister has a expedition...its a real nice vehicle...

I compared the explorer before buying the Pilot...explorer is a nice vehicle but was too much power/fuel consumption (I dont need towing) so I got the pilot

[RLumpy]

Originally posted by a2Pilot

...

I recall an event with my Explorer that remains etched in my mind. I had just run it through a car wash, and was waiting to make a left turn onto a very busy five lane street. A small opening appeared, so I floored it to get out of there. I made it across the first two lanes of traffic when both rear tires broke loose and the rear end began to fish-tail around. Startled, I let off the gas, but I had already gone around nearly 180 degrees. This was a total surprise since the 4.0 V6 was under-powered, and I had the "Limited Slip" rear axle. The pavement was dry, but my tires were wet. Ever since then, I always turned on the four wheel drive when pulling into traffic with wet tires or road. My Explorer was unpredictable without doing that first.

That's the problem with limited slip rear wheel drive. When one wheel starts to spin, the other does also, and then both rear wheels are slipping, into sliding friction coefficient. If you're in a turn, there goes the rear end! With a standard differential, if one wheel breaks loose, usually the one on the inside of the turn, the outside one is still planted solidly (static friction coefficient, much greater than sliding coefficient).
The Pilot's drive system senses when a wheel is slipping and cuts back the torque to that wheel and may apply the brake to that wheel.

[ceads]

i also looked at the Ford and Ive a big ford Fan, I was trading in my Expedition for a new ride.. I looked at a 02 for only 21K with 20K miles BUT this was about 10k off new ..IN only one year . My pilot was used and i still sell it for about the same price. I see Fords all day long. go out of town you will see tons of them at times one after another. I see very few pilots .The ford well looks like a ford on in the inside . Ive had two Explorers and the expedition in the past 6 years and feel I made the right choice. I would like to have a new expedition but cost a lot more to own..Go two www.edmunds.com
and look a the two side by side . The ford costs .64 to .54Cents a mile to own and its cost to own is about 8k more over 5 years .IF you bye the ford you better get a used one with low miles, Expected Resale Value sinks for the Ford .But one problem i had with my Pilot is when i need to go to the shop i have to go 70 miles to the dealer and 120 from the one i bought it from . Ford is in about all town s over 5k. let use know what you do... Chris

[PILOTinginCO]

Ford's customer service stinks. I had to the sue the jerks because my Ford Expedition was a lemon and they didn't want to do the right thing.

The two words that should stick in your head, whether you're planning to keep or sell your PILOT are: RESALE VALUE.

There are 450-thousand Explorers made each year, putting a glut of them on the used car market.

There are 80 to 90-thousand PILOTS made each year, keeping the supply low, keeps demand high, which puts PILOT owners in the driver's seat when it comes to trade-in value. Trust me on this one, I just traded my PILOT for a Touareg and got an incredible trade-in price for my PILOT, because the Honda dealer next door to the VW dealer couldn't wait to get his hands on my PILOT, even with nearly 34-thousand miles on it.

Mrs. PILOTinginCO and I will miss our PILOT.

[Samuel2003]

We have a 98 Explorer Eddie Bauer. It's got some nice features that the Pilot doesn't. Overall, however, we will never buy another Ford - too many problems/irritations. Too bad they didn't have a Pilot in 98...

[mtbenson]

I traded a 2002 Explorer XLT (current style) on my 2004 Pilot LX. Even though the Explorer was easily the most problem-ridden vehicle I've ever owned, the final decision came down to the LX or an Explorer XLS. Here's my side-by-side comparison:

Ride quality/comfort
The Pilot is smoother-riding in every way. Seats are more comfortable (front and rear), and there is more legroom in the Pilot. I can't comment on the third-row, as our Explorer didn't have it, and in the Pilot we've used it only once in two months. The Pilot is about 4 inches wider, which is pleasantly noticeable inside. As a long-time Ford owner, I preferred the Explorer's controls. The Pilot has some annoying interior features, like power outlets that don't stay on when the key is off and cruise-control buttons on the steering wheel that aren't illuminated at night.

Performance
The Explorer is from the truck end of the sport-ute universe, while the Pilot is from the car side of the family, and so the Ford is better at truck-like things like towing and off-roading. The Explorer's 4.0L V6 has more torque, but the Honda is plenty happy to rev and make its power that way. Shifting is much smoother in the Honda. The Pilot gets about 2 mpg better across the board. My best has been about 23.5. The Explorer seemed to turn a bit more sharply. Braking is about even.

Contray to some posts in this thread, I found the Explorer to be sure-footed and confidence-inspiring in snowy, slippery conditions, of which we have plenty here in the mountains of northwest Pennsylvania. The automatic 4WD worked well, the difference being that the Explorer sends its power to the rear wheels until extra traction is needed, while the Pilot is primarily front-wheel drive. I only ever used 4WD low range a couple times.

Build quality
The Pilot wins hands down. Everything is solid and well-put-together. I love the deep "thunk" when shutting the doors. The Explorer had very-easily scratched plastic and one got the feeling that it was sort of bolted together as the designers went along rather than being an integrated design.

Problems with the Explorer included water leaking into the interior, ABS troubles, airbag woes, a keypad entry system that never worked and a few other things I'm trying to block out. Our local Ford dealer took care of all these things without charge, even though he didn't originally sell me the vehicle (I bought if from a non-driving elderly woman I know whose husband died). The week after it hit 36,000 miles and the warranty expired, the engine began running rough and the check-engine light came on. That turned out to be a sparkplug wire that somehow got against a hot engine part and burnt through - how that happened, I have no idea. But it was the last straw.

This is my first Honda. It has been trouble-free in 5,500 miles, except for the CD player going defunct a couple weeks ago. Our dealer has a new one on order. I'm familiar with the reputation of Honda reliability, but I remain uneasy about the dealer being two hours away. With the Explorer, I could drop it off at the dealer and then ride my bicycle the 12 miles home.

So why did I almost buy another Explorer? Overall, I felt it was a good vehicle, and I've had 30 years of being a mostly satisfied Ford owner (and 22 years of being completely sold on Subarus). When the dealer finally discovered the source of the water leak around the roof rack, he also found that at some point in its life it had either been upside down or had something heavy land on the roof, such as a tree. Once you knew where to look, it was obvious that it had been damaged. It started out as a Ford program vehicle, so something happened during that period. I suspect that the water caused a lot of the electronic gremlins, because they stopped when the leak was finally fixed.

I was seriously dealing on an Explorer XLS when I began looking harder at the Pilot and all the great reviews it was receiving. The difference in price between the two was inconsequencial when the Pilot was equipped with the towing package. Then my wife and I drove a Pilot and were sold. Time will tell if we made the right decision, but so far I am very happy.

[74PILOTMOM]

Yes, the wife MUST go drive one...I am "the wife" around here, and as soon as I sat in the driver's seat, I felt in control with amazing visibility, and forgot all about the lack of sunroof. I was absolutely comfortable and felt like I was driving, not being driven.

The turning radius is 39ft... just like the Explorer. The Pilot is a whopping SIX inches wider than the Explorer, and two inches shorter. My across the street neighbor has an '02 Silver Explorer that I feel superior to every time I back out my driveway. They even called it my "fancy new car" when we got our Pilot.

I agree about the seats, the middle seat, 2nd row is horrible. Hard and flat...maybe only because of the activity tray, but in addition to that, the seatbelt cuts right across my face! I'm short, but sheesh!

I'd play the safety card with her...quadruple 4 star crash results, then promise you'll trade in your Pilot (with it's great resale) on the first year they add a sunroof

Go drive one if you can find one. Honda dealerships in my experience have been a NO pressure experience that I actually ENJOYED. Keep us posted, we're here for you!