Pilot MPG vs 2005 Odyssey-cyl shutdown???

[charlie]

Hey,there are some dual owners out there-Pilot-2005 Odyssey.How does the Pilot compare-real world-mpg wise to the 2005 Odyssey with Cyl shutdown.The EXL and above Odysseys are rated at 20-28-the Pilot 17-22.How do they actually do??City HY???? On the same loops as the Pilot??I got 22.25 on a 3000 mile roundtrip from New Orleans to Flagstaff AZ with the Pilot-2003).I get 13-15 mpg pure city-summer 13 with AC always on-with the Pilot.Thanks.Charlie

[Sportymonk]

Based upon reading in another forum, the Ody owners with the cylinder deactivation have been complaining a lot about not getting the mileage they thought they would according to EPA estimates. Based upon their comments, it seems that the cylinder deactivation feature does little for actual gas mileage improvement. It will be interesting if the 06 Pilot picks this feature up so we can compare.

One thing I read about it is that it is the same three cylinders that are deactivated, they do not change the cylinders so you may get some kind of wear pattern but don't know what.

[jay]

I googled this up.

Miles Per Gallon Estimates
From Laura Kramer,

AAA recently announced that "real world" road testing elicits a much different miles per gallon ratio than the Evironmental Protection Agency (EPA) reports.

What's going on

You know EPA mpg reports as the stickers located on every new gar announcing the city miles per gallon and highway miles per gallon, but AAA says you may not want to trust that. In fact, AAA found numerous examples of vehicles that had significanly lower fuel efficiency than reported by the EPA.

Why are the EPA's estimates wrong

AAA says that the EPA is using 30-year-old tests. Not only this but the estimates are not taking into account 65-miles-an-hour and above driving speeds on interstates; traffic; or use of the air conditioner.

What AAA suggests

AAA has announced its support of the "Fuel Efficiency Truth-in-Advertsing Act of 2005" that would require the EPA to update its miles per gallon testing procedures.


Right now, this legislation has bi-partisan support in the US Congresss and is sponsored by Representative Nancy Johnson (R-CT) and Representative Rush Holt (D-NJ).

[jl_ss]

To get EPA values, you need to shut off A/C etc, then tape an egg to the accelerator pedal. Then drive so that you do not brake the egg.... .

[charlie]

The reason I'm curious,is that I can get the EPA hy mpg-22-with the Pilot at about 65mph.I was wondering if the Odyssey with the shutdown actually approaches the EPA 28 hy and whether it is actually 3 mpg better than the LX and EX Odysseys which have EPA hy #'s of 25mpg.I just can't picture getting 6mpg better on our trip to Flagstaff AZ.The Pilot downshifts quite a bit,so that indicates to me that it wouldn't be in the 3 cyl mode very long.The 2005 Odyssey weighs as much as our Pilots-probably has a little less drag,but I'm just wondering if the Odyssey could really get the 28 claimed-the Pilot does get claimed HY MPG(sure as heck doesn't get the 17 mpog city-more like 14 mpg).Thanks.Charlie PS Where are you 2005 Odyssey traitors(or traders) who gave up your Pilots?

[charlie]

Thanks guys.Sporty got me to thinking,so I went to a forum -odyclub I think.There are some less than happy folks there.They have a survey going now.Large number of entries-several hundred(600+,I think).The average is 19+mpg.The absolute best tank is 25.8mpg.There were several 25= entries-100 hy of course.I surprised no one has approached the EPA 28 mpg.The Pilot has plenty of 22+(EPA 22) reports.I got 25 on one hy leg,and did 22+ on a 3000 mile trip at 65 or so.The best EX I saw was 24.7,but there were far more EXL's and above than LX-EX's.The worst mpg was 10.85 .There were several 12+ and 13+ entries.
Via a quick eyeballing it appears the cyl shutdown isn't worth 3mpg hy-maybe 1 mpg or so.It also appears that the Odyssey isn't 6 mpg better hy than the Pilot-more like 1-3 I think.City it looks like about 3 mpg better(EPA 20 VS 17),so in line with EPA numbers,but about 3 less than EPA claims.
I was considering getting a 2005 Ody with cyl shutdown to get the 6 mpg better mpg.I won't give up the Pilot for 2 mpg -12" more room -and loss of AWD-and maybe $10 000 out of pocket.Thanks.Charlie

[osteome]

Not to spark debate....

we cancelled a pending 2005 Odyssey EX-L RES NAV order when the opportunity to get a slightly used 2004 Sienna XLE Limited NAV RSE came up. I lurked and posted on both the respective boards and it would appear that most Odyssey owners with VCm were not getting the MPG they expected and some were wary of the technology (not to mention the typical transmission concerns). It cause some hesitation on our part...

My wife always liked the Sienna better on the ride / noise/ space deparetment so we ended up back with Toyota. Either one would've been fine with me....

[charlie]

Osteome,nothing wrong with the Sienna-except you have to look fairly hard to find one with the side-sidecurtain pk.Does it require premium,or is it ok on regular 87 octane-I'm unclear on that point?The octane-premium-would be a downside,if that is correct.
You can also get AWD with the Sienna.In general,I think you get more for your $$ with the Odyssey,but if you fight hard you can get a Sienna for reasonable $$ now.The 2005 Odyssey apparently has forced $1000 rebates on the Sienna.
What sort of MPG do you get withy the Sienna?Thanks(you traitor).Charlie PS Looks like I'll stick with the Pilot,since there is barely any MPG advantage with the Odyssey(the 2003 Pilots might have a slight MPG advantage over the regeared Pilot -CR mpg was better on their initial test of a 2003 than on their 2005 Pilot)

[osteome]

Originally posted by charlie
Osteome,nothing wrong with the Sienna-except you have to look fairly hard to find one with the side-sidecurtain pk.Does it require premium,or is it ok on regular 87 octane-I'm unclear on that point?The octane-premium-would be a downside,if that is correct.

We run 87 octane and tend to get about 24MPG on average according to my calculations and the on-board comouter. This is mostly with short trips and mostly on surface road rather than the highway. Not to put too much faith in the on-board computer, but the real-time function hovers around 26-27MPG on longer highway trips. IIRC the octane rating has been debated on the Sienna message board, and the general concensus is that premuim may give you an edge on fuel economy, but we have never had a problem with running 87 as far as performance or egine smoothness goes.

You can also get AWD with the Sienna.

You do get stuck with run-flats, which both brand of minvan owners seem to hate (Run-flats standard on the Ody Touring models sold in the US). We are moving out of New England soon, so the AWD was not a big issue to us.


In general,I think you get more for your $$ with the Odyssey,but if you fight hard you can get a Sienna for reasonable $$ now.The 2005 Odyssey apparently has forced $1000 rebates on the Sienna.

We went with Odyssey intially as it was the better value, but my wife always thought that we were 'settling" for a lesser overall vehicle (I know blasphemy). My wife liked a lot about the Sienna that made her continue to second guess the Ody as we waited fro one to be built. I was at the point that I could get either one for next to invoice, but the Sienna (with a few more things standard) was going to be higher in price. If the gently used Sienna that we bought did not come along, I would have taken delivery of the Odyssey about two weeks ago. We did ended up bumping up to a Limited Sienna, so I would have had to compare it more to a Toruing. We did end up paying less for the Sienna (original MSRP of about $39K...yes for a freaking minvan) than we would have for the Odyssey at $200 over invoice. Grnated I have a used vehicle with 16K miles on it, but I actually have a longer powertrain warranty and the comparable extended warranty in the Toyota is about $300 less than it would be in the Honda. My bother -in-law is also a Toyota tech so I get parts and accessories at cost, which is a nice little benefit.

The current rebates will certainly level the playing field.

What sort of MPG do you get withy the Sienna? Thanks(you traitor).Charlie PS Looks like I'll stick with the Pilot,since there is barely any MPG advantage with the Odyssey(the 2003 Pilots might have a slight MPG advantage over the regeared Pilot -CR mpg was better on their initial test of a 2003 than on their 2005 Pilot)

MPG as above. We never hit the MPG estiamtes on our Pilot, but my wife's vehicle tends to be less of a highway cruiser than mine (104 mile commute daily). I do notice that when I "get on it" in the Sienna it has no problem moving right along, despite having fewer ponies than the the Odyssey (I think that the Sienna weights less). Of course nothing has the power of a Titan.

[charlie]

Osteome,thanks.I have heard the run flats are real bricks-ride wise.24 MPG-pretty good!!This must not be in city driving-right?Thanks.Charlie

[jl_ss]

Originally posted by charlie
Osteome,thanks.I have heard the run flats are real bricks-ride wise.24 MPG-pretty good!!This must not be in city driving-right?Thanks.Charlie

The run-flats are expensive, hard to get locally, and very low mileage tires. We experienced that first hand after a flat with our AWD Sienna.

[osteome]

Originally posted by jl_ss


The run-flats are expensive, hard to get locally, and very low mileage tires. We experienced that first hand after a flat with our AWD Sienna.

I have not been following the Odyssey boards lately, but IIRC no one was a big fan of the PAX system that is on the Touring. I would have gone for the AWD just for security, but the run-flat saga was enough for me pass (the dealer that we bought our Certified one from, only had one FWD, but had three AWDs). The tires are indeed hard to "service", expensive to replace, wear out too soon, and give a marginal ride. Tou can prucahse a spare for the AWD, but lose the ability to fold a portion of the third row seat if you place where it was intended.

Our MPG of 23 in the Sienna is with mixed driving (50 / 50 mix). I have yet to expend a full tank on the highway, but the up to the minute MPG estimator on the on-board system hangs out at around 26MPG...not sure if this would bear out in the 400 mile tank range as we have yet to take a trip that long. We are definitely doing much better than our particular Pilot.

[charlie]

Osteome-JL_SS,thanks!Your mpg is much better than the Odyssey folks are getting-they get 19 mpg on average from 600+ fillups.Some are unhappy!!Let us know how much better your Sienna MPG does relative to the Pilot??
I wonder if the AWD Sienna's can use "
normal" wheels and tires?Guess you can't put a "normal" tire on an AWD rim??What do you think-JL_SS? Thanks.Charlie

[osteome]

Originally posted by charlie
Osteome-JL_SS,thanks!Your mpg is much better than the Odyssey folks are getting-they get 19 mpg on average from 600+ fillups.Some are unhappy!!Let us know how much better your Sienna MPG does relative to the Pilot??
I wonder if the AWD Sienna's can use "
normal" wheels and tires?Guess you can't put a "normal" tire on an AWD rim??What do you think-JL_SS? Thanks.Charlie

If I remember correctly some of the folks over at www.siennaclub.org have replaced their runflats with "regular" tires. You would still need a spare though.

The whole reason for the runflats is due to the fact the AWD hardware takes up the spot under the vehcice that would normally hold the donut spare. I am not sure why Honda chose runflats on the US Toruing models.

I will try to keep posted on the MPG over time, but so far it is a significant improvement. Our van did have 16K on the odo when we got it, so it may have helped to have some break in miles behind it.

[Sportymonk]

IIRC, on the Honda ODy, you can not put a different tire on as it is a special size tire and rim. On the Toyota Sienna, you can put a different tire on.

The problem is that if you have a flat on a long trip on a Friday night, you will be stranded until Monday morning when you can start looking for the nearest Honda Dealer and hope they have a replacement tire. In a major city they may have, in a small out of the way spot in the middle of nowhere, good luck!