DIY VTM-4 (differential) Fluid change with pictures

[slugmike]

do you need to jack the car up to do this?

or do you just crawl under there?

[Sunday Rider]

Originally posted by slugmike
do you need to jack the car up to do this?

or do you just crawl under there?

Just crawl under, but it is easier if you drop the spare tire and get it out of the way. That way you can get at the fill plug with more muscle if you need to open it.

Good time to clean out the grunge on the spare as well.

[Sunday Rider]

Originally posted by jon316
Aside from sounding like a dime-store novel detective, where are the jack points and jack stand points for the Pilot? (From Helm manual, not the owner's manual.) The unibodies are kinda picky about where you touch them. (Please, no RTM's; I don't have the Helm manual, yet.)

I didn't want to start a new thread for this simple question. Please forgive is this is out of place.

There are two main jack points. You will see them in the front and back around the middle, those are for getting the axles of the ground. There is a thread here somewhere.

The wheel jack points are just behind the front wheel well, and just in front of the back wheel well. You can see there is a kind of a bend and thickening of the sheet metal. I have also used the "fake" I beam where is is flat. I think near the rear it tends to curve, so I have not used it there.

If you get under and look you will see what I mean. I just used them on weekend to lift the Pilot up and take off the snow tires. Good luck

Here's a link where it lifted at a shop, gives you some ideas
2004 Pilot Underside

[jon316]

Originally posted by Sunday Rider


The wheel jack points are just behind the front wheel well, and just in front of the back wheel well. You can see there is a kind of a bend and thickening of the sheet metal. I have also used the "fake" I beam where is is flat. I think near the rear it tends to curve, so I have not used it there.

Here's a link where it lifted at a shop, gives you some ideas
2004 Pilot Underside

Thank-you for the reply, and the link. I've always had to exercise caution when using floor jacks and jack stands on a unibody, and I was hoping (like on my Jetta) there were some alternate points. I deformed a jack point on my Miata, once. I'm going to install the MDX rear brace retrofit this weekend.

[PhishingPhreak]

Knocked out my first VTM fluid change yesterday.

Thanks to HP.org and its members for the great DIY instructions.

Two small issues I had:

1) Breaking free the bolts. This was solved with a cheater bar.
2) The pump I bought, is a "grease gun" style pump/suction apparatus. The chamber only holds 16oz, so it took several fillings to refill the fluid.

That being said, when I spoke to the Honda parts guy, he advised that at his shop they only remove one of the plugs, then suck all the fluid out, and just pump the refill back in.

One last thing, my 2005 Pilot, had crush washers on each plug, which the parts guy didnt know. He thought there was only one on the drain. I replaced both of course.

[nighthawkpilot3]

Hey all,

Another good fill method is to have an inexpensive tube which screws right on to the jug. You can get these at Advance Auto or other places. They work on quarts too. Just put on like you would a cap. The part is two-piece - one is the clear tube and one is the "cap" which has has a black and a red section. They turn and allow you to shut off flow. So, you can turn the whole jug upside down with no fluid release until you open it. You can then squeeze out all the fluid you need. I find it better to pour off some into another container, but you dont have to. I usually have a part of a jug and just guesstimate what I will need. And yes, it is about 3 quarts. Keep filling until it drools out. Obviously, best to fill slowly, especially toward the end. On the washer, as I posted in another thread about Trans fluid change on an 03, turning them over works great. If you get confused on which way, just feel for a groove on the inner part of the washer. If you cant feel one, then it doesnt matter. The whole reason to turn it is to have a flat side against the case and allow the bolt to flatten the washer on its side. Also, the rear dif and trans drain plugs take the same washer. Buy a few and oil ones next time you order from wherever you get parts - like Majestic Honda, Bill Kay, H and A, etc. Rear dif fluid recycles just like ATF and motor oil and it doesnt matter if you mix them for recycling.

[AznSlumLord]

Took care of this today and it was pretty simple. The hardest part was getting the bolts off (used breaker bar + pipe). Besides that, it just took a little time to pump the fluid back into the rear diff...very easy DIY job though and definitely saved me some money since I just got reemed from a dealer brake job

[nighthawkpilot3]

Those things have a tendency to seize - the plugs and especially the caps. I have found that a good torque wrench works well because of the length. The key is to give it a rocking or a snap - this works sort of like an impact wrench would and it breaks it loose.

[mprince]

Originally posted by nighthawkpilot3
I have found that a good torque wrench works well because of the length.

Length is the key to leverage, but I would use a 3/8" breaker bar to free the bolts - ratcheting tools (esp a sensitive torque wrench) should not be used to break bolts free if you want them to last.

[nighthawkpilot3]

Yeah. You are right about the torque wrench or any other ratcheting tool. It does aid with the leverage because of the length, and the rocking or snapping applies even with a breaker bar or whatever you use.

[andyschneider]

Originally posted by nighthawkpilot3
Those things have a tendency to seize - the plugs and especially the caps. I have found that a good torque wrench works well because of the length. The key is to give it a rocking or a snap - this works sort of like an impact wrench would and it breaks it loose.

I just went and did the VTM4 and tranny fluid drain/fills this weekend, and on each one I just used my normal 10 inch 3/8 ratchet to loosen all of the bolts - just tap the end of the handle with your hand several times in a sharp fashion, and they just pop open. I've found that with these alloy drain "bolts", if you try to use a breaker bar and use leverage to pop them open, it puts a lot more stress on the bolt/socket area, and you risk stripping or breaking. Quick taps on a wrench are typically enough to pop them open, even lying on your back with a spare tire staring you in the face.

andy

[Sunday Rider]

Originally posted by andyschneider

I just went and did the VTM4 and tranny fluid drain/fills this weekend, and on each one I just used my normal 10 inch 3/8 ratchet to loosen all of the bolts - just tap the end of the handle with your hand several times in a sharp fashion, and they just pop open. I've found that with these alloy drain "bolts", if you try to use a breaker bar and use leverage to pop them open, it puts a lot more stress on the bolt/socket area, and you risk stripping or breaking. Quick taps on a wrench are typically enough to pop them open, even lying on your back with a spare tire staring you in the face.

andy

Funny, last time I did the quick tap thing, I skinned my knuckels on the full size spare. So now I take it down and clean it too before I do the VTM4 fluid change. Amazing how pain, makes you take the extra step

[andyschneider]

Originally posted by Sunday Rider


Funny, last time I did the quick tap thing, I skinned my knuckels on the full size spare. So now I take it down and clean it too before I do the VTM4 fluid change. Amazing how pain, makes you take the extra step

So when I loosened the fill and drain plugs, I did it from in front of the rear suspension (while lying on my back), so the full-sized spare didn't come into play. However, when getting ready to fill the unit back up, I quickly realized I could either cuss and swear for 15 mins as I tried to jockey the gallon jug with pump into spots few and far between, or remove the spare and have an easy time of it. Guess which I chose? Made it a much easier task! When i did it on the '04, it had the small spare and you had enough room to do things without removing the tire - but the full sized spare just took up toooo much room.

andy

[number1italian]

Thanks for this great DIY. I am always looking for ways to keep from using the dealer.

Does anyone know the torgue for tightening the VTM-4 drain & fill bolts? The parts guys stated that the crushable washers are important to keep you from stripping out the threads.

[k_alavi]

I changed the VTM-4 fluid on our 2005 Pilot yesterday.

Fairly easy job, specially with the hand pump that I bought from schucks.

I wanted to reply to this thread to make two points.

1- I did not need a ratchet extension. There was enough room behind the metal brace and in front of the differential fill bolt so I was able to use my ratchet by itself. So you may want to try that.

2- A few membere have mentioned that they actually had to top off the differntial after a refill and after driving a few miles. So I had to verify that. I opened the fill bolt and I too was able to add some more fluid to top it off. My guess (and it's just a guess) is that when we drain the fluid, there maybe some air pockets left after the refill. So when we drive a few miles that the differential relieves itself (sort of speak) of the air pocket and there is more room to top off.

Thanks every one contibuting to this thread and to the entire forum.