AC temp differences front/rear

[darkdeacon]

Greetings,

I have an 03 Pilot EX. It just hit 100k so I had the timing belt and water pump replaced a few days before a family trip to S. Carolina.

Somewhere in the mountains of Tennessee, the AC compressor starts making a horrible noise before quitting.

I had a new compressor and dryer installed at a shop is SC for a whopping $1200. All seemed well until we departed to return home.... the front vents were blowing warm air, but the rear vents were blowing cold.

We drove for several hours before stopping for lunch. Upon resuming, the front vents began blowing some cold air, but still not as cold as the rear.

Once home, I took it back to my mechanic. He tested the system and it showed that the pressure was fine but there was a 20+ degree difference in temperatures blowing from front and rear vents (70 vs 50).

He seemed perplexed. I believehe mentioned something about a "door"/damper in the system that might be sticking open allowing hot air to mix.

Two questions:

1. Any idea what could be causing the temp differences and how it might be remedied?

2. Could these AC problems be a result of the timing belt work that was done? It seems an odd coincidence as I wasn't having any problems before.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

[rocky]

Stories like this make me want to ensure that if I ever have this kind of misfortune, that I have the work done by a shop where there can be some accountability to support warranty work back where I call home.

The rear has its own cooling system built into the console. So I'm not surprised that you are experiencing differing temperatures between the front and rear.

I'm no AC expert, but has the local shop confirmed that the ac system is properly charged?

I don't know if the AC has to be messed with to perform the TB change. Gut reaction is that its unlikely. There is an excellent thread on DIY TB change which I confess I didn't read in detail as its not a job I am likely to do.

[N_Jay]

Originally Posted by darkdeacon

Greetings,

I have an 03 Pilot EX. It just hit 100k so I had the timing belt and water pump replaced a few days before a family trip to S. Carolina.

Somewhere in the mountains of Tennessee, the AC compressor starts making a horrible noise before quitting.

I had a new compressor and dryer installed at a shop is SC for a whopping $1200. All seemed well until we departed to return home.... the front vents were blowing warm air, but the rear vents were blowing cold.

We drove for several hours before stopping for lunch. Upon resuming, the front vents began blowing some cold air, but still not as cold as the rear.

Once home, I took it back to my mechanic. He tested the system and it showed that the pressure was fine but there was a 20+ degree difference in temperatures blowing from front and rear vents (70 vs 50).

He seemed perplexed. I believehe mentioned something about a "door"/damper in the system that might be sticking open allowing hot air to mix.

Two questions:

1. Any idea what could be causing the temp differences and how it might be remedied?

2. Could these AC problems be a result of the timing belt work that was done? It seems an odd coincidence as I wasn't having any problems before.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide.

Seems like '03 compressors have started expiring.
Mine just died last weekend.

[moda_way]

Originally Posted by N_Jay

Seems like '03 compressors have started expiring.
Mine just died last weekend.

It is seen across almost every line from what I've heard; minor in some and bad in others. Most of the compressors strapped to the K24 motors are nicknamed grenades. The clutch seizes and drops out the bottom of the engine bay. I've been hearing more and more stories from various J32 motors recently.

I'm not sure if it the fact that routine maintenance is not done on the system since the lubricant is a critical part in the coolant or particulates are making it in from another source, but I've never serviced mine (rarely use the A/C) and have nightmares about it going. So I'll probably hit up my dealer buddy to do a service soon.

[N_Jay]

The only ones I have hear a LOT of issues with are 02-04 CRVs.

Almost all new systems are very critical about overfilling. Honda's seems to be a little worse.

Most AC's last longest when used occasionally as sitting is bad for a compressor. Being as the compressor on almost all cars cycles with the defroster, this is not the issue it used to be.

My AC guy sees very few Hondas except for 02-04 CRVs (and I got one).

Usually the compressor locks up and then the clutch fails.

[moda_way]

Originally Posted by N_Jay

The only ones I have hear a LOT of issues with are 02-04 CRVs.

Almost all new systems are very critical about overfilling. Honda's seems to be a little worse.

Most AC's last longest when used occasionally as sitting is bad for a compressor. Being as the compressor on almost all cars cycles with the defroster, this is not the issue it used to be.

My AC guy sees very few Hondas except for 02-04 CRVs (and I got one).

Usually the compressor locks up and then the clutch fails.

Yep, same issue as the other K24s like in my TSX. After the compressor locks, the grind pollutes the entire system, which then has to be replaced. Sweet design.

[N_Jay]

But what makes the 02-04 CRvs the worse of the bunch?

BTW, just got the call on the Pilot.

Destroyed compressor.

Some debris in system (Hopefully desiccant sock caught it all)
System is getting a VERY through flush and clean.

New compressor, New condenser with (obviously) new desiccant sock and fill.

About $1100 with a one year guarantee.

Also, only compressors available are OEM, so there are obviously not enough failures to prompt an aftermarket suppply.

[moda_way]

Originally Posted by N_Jay

But what makes the 02-04 CRvs the worse of the bunch?

BTW, just got the call on the Pilot.

Destroyed compressor.

Some debris in system (Hopefully desiccant sock caught it all)
System is getting a VERY through flush and clean.

New compressor, New condenser with (obviously) new desiccant sock and fill.

About $1100 with a one year guarantee.

Also, only compressors available are OEM, so there are obviously not enough failures to prompt an aftermarket suppply.

I bet they find the filter so clogged they fear particulate in the lines... that's what happens to the TSX crowd. $1400 in parts alone. Good luck man!! I know few folks that are on their 2nd compressor, condenser and lines. There is a company making an aftermarket compressor for the TSX.

CR-Vs aren't any worse than the Elements or TSXs based on conversations with mechanics. What bothers me is why are the 2003+ Accords and RSXs (K20) not having the issue? Much more rare in the Accords with K24s and it is nearly a mirror copy of the other K24s.

[N_Jay]

There is not true "filter", but the desiccant in the cloth sock is the fist thing the compressed refrigerant flows though, so it cats like a filter.

I wonder how fast these things get fail.
Mine went out this weekend (was run very little after noticing the problem) and the desiccant sock was already dirty looking.
So, I thinking,m maybe the compressor starts shedding material for a while and eventually fails completely, rather then the traditional thinking that everything is fine, and then the compressor fails putting a load of debris into the system.

Just a thought?

Maybe on older systems the thing to do would be to drain the system, change the desiccant sock, and then recharge every few years as preventative maintenance??

[moda_way]

Yeah, we just refer to them as filters so as not having to call it a desiccant sock.

Your thoughts and preventative maintenance are all things we considered on the TSX forums. The issue isn't when the compressor fails, but why. Why are the internals failing and polluting the system? Is it lack of maintenance on the coolant/lubricant, poor internal components or poor design?

[darkdeacon]

Originally Posted by rocky

Stories like this make me want to ensure that if I ever have this kind of misfortune, that I have the work done by a shop where there can be some accountability to support warranty work back where I call home.

The rear has its own cooling system built into the console. So I'm not surprised that you are experiencing differing temperatures between the front and rear.

I'm no AC expert, but has the local shop confirmed that the ac system is properly charged?

I don't know if the AC has to be messed with to perform the TB change. Gut reaction is that its unlikely. There is an excellent thread on DIY TB change which I confess I didn't read in detail as its not a job I am likely to do.

Thanks for the feedback, Rocky.

I did have the work done at a NAPA garage and did get a NAPA warranty (for whatever that is worth). That's why I am hoping it is a problem related to the installation of new compressor and not something new. And yes, it is properly charged.

I'll show my extensive automotive ignorance now (if I haven't already)... Is the rear unit really a separate unit?? The local mechanic says the cold air is only coming from one unit and is being diverted via ducts to the rear. Is that true?

thanks

[N_Jay]

Originally Posted by moda_way

Yeah, we just refer to them as filters so as not having to call it a desiccant sock.

Your thoughts and preventative maintenance are all things we considered on the TSX forums. The issue isn't when the compressor fails, but why. Why are the internals failing and polluting the system? Is it lack of maintenance on the coolant/lubricant, poor internal components or poor design?

Well there is no recommended service or maintenance.

And, as long as the charge is not lost then the oil is not lost.

And no one looks inside until there is a failure,

SO, that leaves us wondering is
1) the failures are a sudden event,
or,
2) the failures occur over time

If they are over time,
1) does the build up of contaminants in the refrigerant/oil contribute to the failure,
or,
2) is it just a symptom of the failing compressor.

If it the build up of contaminants contributes to the failure,
1) will changing the sock and a good portion of the oil forestall the eventual failure
or,
2) would it be cost prohibitive to do a thorough enough internal cleaning to make a difference.

[N_Jay]

Originally Posted by darkdeacon

I'll show my extensive automotive ignorance now (if I haven't already)... Is the rear unit really a separate unit?? The local mechanic says the cold air is only coming from one unit and is being diverted via ducts to the rear. Is that true?

thanks

One compressor,
One common flow of refrigerant
One common condenser (under hood radiator thing) (Cools hot refrigerant with outside air)
Two independent evaporators (in dash and in console radiators thingies) (Cools hot inside air with refrigerant)
Two independent fans
Two independent air flow paths.

[moda_way]

My guess is Honda doesn't know why they are failing. TSX drivers had catastrophic failures which polluted the screen/filter. A time study would tell if there is a long-run failure, but I'm certain Honda isn't interested in that. I will have my screen looked at when I got to get my A/C maintained; which is working fine right now.

FYI, Acura and Honda call it a filter, part (80101-SEA-003)

[N_Jay]

But once you need it serviced it will be too late to know whether it was a slow failure or a sudden one.